The Dark Horse Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 Was going through a discussion on Twitter. Kapil was an absolute freak. ODI Strike rate - 95 ODI strike rate in world cups - 115 Test strike rate - 82.xx He was THE definition of a dasher. Pity I wasn’t born to see his batting live.. If not for captaincy may be he could have done even better(?) saik, velu, Real McCoy and 1 other 4 Link to comment
velu Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 Real McCoy, The Dark Horse and Adamant 1 2 Link to comment
rtmohanlal Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 (edited) one of the players in the history of the game when context taken into account , was way way more than his plain averages. People often under rate Kapil by taking just his plain averages. Kapil should be evaluated based on these facts In test bowling - longevity, lack of support bowling & work density. Hence for me he is a 26.25- 26.85 range test bowler In test batting his role was to put as much runs in the company of tail enders.His str: was almost 81(every chance of it being even as high as 82.5) and after 131 inns it was about 84.5. Edited April 15, 2020 by rtmohanlal Vk1 1 Link to comment
rkt.india Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 4 hours ago, The Dark Horse said: Was going through a discussion on Twitter. Kapil was an absolute freak. ODI Strike rate - 95 ODI strike rate in world cups - 115 Test strike rate - 82.xx He was THE definition of a dasher. Pity I wasn’t born to see his batting live.. If not for captaincy may be he could have done even better(?) He was very much what Afridi was in late 90s, early 2000s. Link to comment
rkt.india Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 36 minutes ago, rtmohanlal said: one of the players in the history of the game when context taken into account , was way way more than his plain averages. People often under rate Kapil by taking just his plain averages. Kapil should be evaluated based on these facts In test bowling - longevity, lack of support bowling & work density. Hence for me he is a 26.25- 26.85 range test bowler In test batting his role was to put as much runs in the company of tail enders.His str: was almost 81(every chance of it being even as high as 82.5) and after 131 inns it was about 84.5. He would have batted the same way irrespective of the position he batted, very much like Sehwag, Srikant etc Link to comment
The Dark Horse Posted April 15, 2020 Author Share Posted April 15, 2020 29 minutes ago, rkt.india said: He was very much what Afridi was in late 90s, early 2000s. I don't think he was as brainless as Afridi saik 1 Link to comment
Straight Drive Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 Only Kapil could match the strike rate of Viv. Link to comment
Straight Drive Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 (edited) In 1986 Lord's test he hit 18 runs in one over against Phil Edmonds to win the test for India. Kapil was one of the most natural batsman and bowling action. His peak in ODI coincided with India winning the world cup. India had lost two warmup matches, yet under the captaincy of Kapil the team was motivated enough to overcome the initial dismal performances and come back strongly. The 175 innings which turned the match on its head was another performance which made team believe that they could win the WC. To beat WI twice in that WC was indeed a huge achievement. Edited April 15, 2020 by Straight Drive Real McCoy, velu and BacktoCricaddict 3 Link to comment
maniac Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 A 24 year old guy in his 4th year of cricket captaining a pretty mediocre side in English conditions, plays probably what is the most defining and clutch innings in the history of the game and then goes on to lead his team in beating the greatest side ever in history of cricket not once but twice and that too defending a score of 180 odd is a stuff of legend. we hear this bs catchphrase Of cornered tigers etc which was not a patch on this accomplishment. Same goes for other underdog triumph like SL in 1996 which doesn’t even come close to this. I know some cheap Bollywood biopic is being made finally but despite being regarded as the moment that changed cricket forever this isn’t talked about as much as some random ashes and other cricketing events. Cricspin, Laaloo, Vk1 and 3 others 2 4 Link to comment
Gollum Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 (edited) 14 minutes ago, maniac said: Same goes for other underdog triumph like SL in 1996 which doesn’t even come close to this. SL triumph too was legendary. Came when their country was in civil war, early-mid 90s saw many terror attacks incl assassinations of several leading figures incl Presidents (like Premadasa). Cricket too was badly affected, Ranatunga was seen as a unifying factor esp the way he backed a Tamil Hindu player in Australia. Teams declining to play in SL, their team smashing every team incl India 2x, then Ranatunga openly saying he wanted Aussies in Lahore. Finally a brilliant final against clutch (and soon to be ATG) Aussies with a team successfully chasing for the 1st time ever, ATG 100 by Mad Max. Great story considering Lankans were recent entrants to the world of cricket. Like India they hadn't done much in previous WCs. Not as great as 83 but 96 was quite close when talking about underdog triumphs. Edited April 15, 2020 by Gollum The Dark Horse, Vk1, AuxiliA and 1 other 4 Link to comment
Gollum Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 In an ODI AT world XI, Kapil will be among the top 3 picks, King Viv being numero uno and maybe Garner 2nd. Link to comment
Straight Drive Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 9 minutes ago, Gollum said: SL triumph too was legendary. Came when their country was in civil war, early-mid 90s saw many terror attacks incl assassinations of several leading figures incl Presidents (like Premadasa). Cricket too was badly affected, Ranatunga was seen as a unifying factor esp the way he backed a Tamil Hindu player in Australia. Teams declining to play in SL, their team smashing every team incl India 2x, then Ranatunga openly saying he wanted Aussies in Lahore. Finally a brilliant final against clutch (and soon to be ATG) Aussies with a team successfully chasing for the 1st time ever, ATG 100 by Mad Max. Great story considering Lankans were new entrants to the world of cricket. Like India they hadn't done much in previous WCs. Not as great as 83 but 96 was quite close when talking about underdog triumphs. Yeah, iirc SL started playing ODI very late as compared to India. Their win came quicker Link to comment
zen Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 (edited) Always liked Kapil as a batsman. Did not do justice to his immense potential. Could have averaged 40+ in tests Edited April 15, 2020 by zen Link to comment
rtmohanlal Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 1 hour ago, rkt.india said: He would have batted the same way irrespective of the position he batted, very much like Sehwag, Srikant etc Kapil was capable of altering his batting style according to the situation, not that he always did that. I would pick a few inns of his where he played a bit more casually as per the situation demanded. runs balls str: 30 72 41.66 v Pakistan Kolkata 29 Jan 1980 45* 82 54.87 v England Mumbai15 Feb 1980 41 69 59.42 v England Lord's 10 Jun 1982 60 97 61.85 v England Delhi 12 Dec 1984 66 117 56.41 v Pakistan Kolkata11 Feb 1987 56 83 67.46 v Australia Adelaide 25 Jan 1992 60 95 63.15 v Zimbabwe Harare 18 Oct 1992 129 180 71.66 v South Africa Port Elizabeth 26 Dec 1992 34 72 47.22 v South Africa Cape Town 2 Jan 1993 All these inns were played when India needed them the most. Especially notice the last 4 inns, all of them in a single year space and in the toughest of conditions. Not that Kapil was capable of doing a Dravid like role, but still he could play defensively if needed. Cricspin, The Dark Horse and saik 3 Link to comment
maniac Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 46 minutes ago, Gollum said: SL triumph too was legendary. Came when their country was in civil war, early-mid 90s saw many terror attacks incl assassinations of several leading figures incl Presidents (like Premadasa). Cricket too was badly affected, Ranatunga was seen as a unifying factor esp the way he backed a Tamil Hindu player in Australia. Teams declining to play in SL, their team smashing every team incl India 2x, then Ranatunga openly saying he wanted Aussies in Lahore. Finally a brilliant final against clutch (and soon to be ATG) Aussies with a team successfully chasing for the 1st time ever, ATG 100 by Mad Max. Great story considering Lankans were recent entrants to the world of cricket. Like India they hadn't done much in previous WCs. Not as great as 83 but 96 was quite close when talking about underdog triumphs. True not taking anything away from SL. However from 1975-2019, 1975-1979- Fav team won 2003-2019-Fav team won that leaves us with 83,87,92,96 and 1999 if I have to rank the wins according to the back to the wall performances against all odds , handling pressure and over all performance then 1983 1996/1999 (tie) 1992 1987 in that order Gollum 1 Link to comment
rkt.india Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 32 minutes ago, rtmohanlal said: Kapil was capable of altering his batting style according to the situation, not that he always did that. I would pick a few inns of his where he played a bit more casually as per the situation demanded. runs balls str: 30 72 41.66 v Pakistan Kolkata 29 Jan 1980 45* 82 54.87 v England Mumbai15 Feb 1980 41 69 59.42 v England Lord's 10 Jun 1982 60 97 61.85 v England Delhi 12 Dec 1984 66 117 56.41 v Pakistan Kolkata11 Feb 1987 56 83 67.46 v Australia Adelaide 25 Jan 1992 60 95 63.15 v Zimbabwe Harare 18 Oct 1992 129 180 71.66 v South Africa Port Elizabeth 26 Dec 1992 34 72 47.22 v South Africa Cape Town 2 Jan 1993 All these inns were played when India needed them the most. Especially notice the last 4 inns, all of them in a single year space and in the toughest of conditions. Not that Kapil was capable of doing a Dravid like role, but still he could play defensively if needed. Even Sehwag has some such innings, not that he always did it. Kapil didn't take his batting seriously enough. He did play some great innings but he could have been much better with the bat. Link to comment
rtmohanlal Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 18 minutes ago, rkt.india said: Even Sehwag has some such innings, not that he always did it. Kapil didn't take his batting seriously enough. He did play some great innings but he could have been much better with the bat. might most probably be. Despite that , when I evaluate Kapil the batsman I take into account his huge str; also. Viv dominated the bowlers with an str: of 70 when all batsmen of his time were having 35-45 str: . And Kapil had almost 81(most probably it is around 82.5 as per my analysis of ball count missing inns of Kapil in cricinfo). Such level of domination deserves extra points. Link to comment
velu Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 1 hour ago, maniac said: A 24 year old guy in his 4th year of cricket captaining a pretty mediocre side in English conditions 23 yr old guy in his 3rd year of intl cricket , captaining it for the first time in south African conditions ... well Link to comment
Deleted_User_1 Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, The Dark Horse said: I don't think he was as brainless as Afridi Kapil has been the best all-rounder India has had so far by a country mile. I was lucky to see him live on TV and in maidan, on several occasions. However, he did have his brain fart moments, although not anywhere as bad as Afretard. One time, he gave his wicket away just out of spite for Sunny. He was dropped the next match. Now Sunny and Kapil respect each other, but during their playing time in the 80s, their off-field rivalry got very nasty at times. Edited April 15, 2020 by Audiophile The Dark Horse and Real McCoy 1 1 Link to comment
maniac Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 2 hours ago, velu said: 23 yr old guy in his 3rd year of intl cricket , captaining it for the first time in south African conditions ... well Well if you think that was the same level of incredible accomplishment that the 83 WC was then nothing to say. Defending 180 against that WI team or singlehandedly hitting a 175 to save team from elimination is a different level of mythical effort. Link to comment
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