Dissecting the test defeat

[BacktoCricaddict]

1 hour ago, SK_IH said:

Also, India had some freak dismissals in their first innings that derailed the innings & match. It was a clear case of everything that could go wrong was going wrong. However, I have no sympathy for that phoney Rahane, he continues to hog that crucial spot in the middle order with zero consistency.

It's a tough call.  While your point is well-taken and I shared this opinion before the Aus tour, I cannot imagine dropping him right on the heels of the greatest test-series victory of all time and the crucial role that he played in it as captain.  

[nitinbwj]

There was a time when Jadeja was ridiculed by everyone but by God he has improved tremendously. Has become an impact player. Fearless bat, gutsy and can play according to situation.Gun fielder and very accurate bowler. We miss him badly. 

[nitinbwj]

If the pitch stays the same for the next match, why not include Siraj and Kuldeep. Siraj I think will bowl better than Ishant

[SK_IH]

Just now, BacktoCricaddict said:

It's a tough call.  While your point is well-taken and I shared this opinion before the Aus tour, I cannot imagine dropping him right on the heels of the greatest test-series victory of all time and the crucial role that he played in it as captain.  

You cannot look at previous tour in isolation. It's a trend with this guy, inconsistency is his hallmark. I am being honest when he came to bat in both innings I was dead cert if wouldn't survive & he didn't surprise. 

Obviously he ain't going anywhere as the captain himself said but Indian cricket will not realise its potential if they don't time the ouster of guys like Rahane, Dhawan, Ishant & Pujara. There is lots talent in India, if you have to be a regular you need to earn it.

[Yoda-esque]

They just underestimated England.Simple.

[BacktoCricaddict]

Just now, SK_IH said:

You cannot look at previous tour in isolation. It's a trend with this guy, inconsistency is his hallmark. I am being honest when he came to bat in both innings I was dead cert if wouldn't survive & he didn't surprise. 

Obviously he ain't going anywhere as the captain himself said but Indian cricket will not realise its potential if they don't time the ouster of guys like Rahane, Dhawan, Ishant & Pujara. There is lots talent in India, if you have to be a regular you need to earn it.

Agree with everything you are saying, but I am being pulled back by the emotion of watching his brilliant leadership.  It would be so much easier if he had made at least one 60-80 run knock after MCG.  Then, we could justify fully asking for him to be elevated to captaincy.  

[Yoda-esque]

Ideally Rahane and Rohit shouldn't be in the team.Replace them with Sundar and Mayank or Rahul and get Jadeja in

[Sooda]

3 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

Some people mentioned fielding, but as an afterthought.  To me, the vast difference in fielding outcomes between the two sides is one of two major causes for the defeat (other being Nadeem's selection).  If India had held on to at least 1-2 of the half-chances that came their way, England would have made 100 fewer runs in their 1st innings.  Also, from an intangibles standpoint, it gives life to tired team-mates and the bowling unit.

 

Sometimes, we ask the question "who wanted it more?"  Answer: The side that does the basics right and gives full effort on the field.  It was England in this case. 

 

Gawd, I miss Jadeja.

 

 

 

People keep saying Nadeems selection: nothing wrong with him being picked, his performance OTOH was very disappointing. Has more than enough FC experience to have been better than that performance.

[BacktoCricaddict]

7 minutes ago, Sooda said:

 

People keep saying Nadeems selection: nothing wrong with him being picked, his performance OTOH was very disappointing. Has more than enough FC experience to have been better than that performance.

He wasn't even in the squad and was called out of nowhere.  While the logic of taking someone who spins the ball "the other way" is reasonable, you can't just throw someone in there and expect them to deliver.  As for FC experience, it may be a bit over-rated sometimes.  Sundar, Thakur, even Natarajan. showed that.  They were net bowlers, hanging with the squad the whole time and clicked when needed.  

[gloryof83]

I thought our bowling was fine, Nadeem excepted. Our first innings is where we lost, day 3 was still good for batting. At least 2 of top 5 should have made hundreds.

 

coming to the second test, given the short turn around and that we play back to back games in ahmedabad as well, it is imperative that we rotate our fast bowlers.

• Ishant rested, Siraj in
• Nadeem out, Axar / Kuldeep in

Anyone know when Jadeja / Shami / Umesh are back?

[Yoda-esque]

Bumrah was the fourth best seamer in this match

[adi B]

I think Indian team thought that they'd just turn up and defeat England ,but released quickly that the levels were not up and England came well prepared. 

We need to raise our game big time and come up with plans for every batsmen in the English side ,it looks like any of there batsmen can step up and get big runs,even sibley and Lawrence. 

Toss is another factor especially considering the fact that we are already light in the bowling department with 3 class bowlers out injured.

if we lose the toss and ashwin has a typical average 1st day ,god save us 

[ash]

Two main factors

 

1) Ashwin was not supported properly in the 1st innings.  No proper pressure applied from both ends. Should have bundled them for 400. 

2) 1st innings top order batting

[New guy]

5 hours ago, Yoda-esque said:

Bumrah was the fourth best seamer in this match

Disagree, apart from the initial burst in first innings, Archer did nothing. Bumrah on a day 5 pitch would have been lethal. Toss was all important

[dilliboy]

14 hours ago, SK_IH said:

You cannot look at previous tour in isolation. It's a trend with this guy, inconsistency is his hallmark. I am being honest when he came to bat in both innings I was dead cert if wouldn't survive & he didn't surprise. 

Obviously he ain't going anywhere as the captain himself said but Indian cricket will not realise its potential if they don't time the ouster of guys like Rahane, Dhawan, Ishant & Pujara. There is lots talent in India, if you have to be a regular you need to earn it.

Agree with Rahane and Dhawan but Ishant has improved tremendously and rarely disappoints. Comical to even suggest about dropping Pujara

[SK_IH]

1 hour ago, dilliboy said:

Agree with Rahane and Dhawan but Ishant has improved tremendously and rarely disappoints. Comical to even suggest about dropping Pujara

Not talking/suggesting about dropping them instantly. They have to be phased out timely.  You can't stuck with certain players just because they are seniors. 

[Stan AF]

What is there to dissect?

 

BS Team selection

Ineffective bowling in 1st innings.

No balls.

No batsman made a 100 in the 1st innings.

 

Match was gone when england made 500. And since then the only hope for india was for a draw like rajkot 2016/17 

[R!TTER]

1 minute ago, Stan AF said:

And since then the only hope for india was for a draw like rajkot 2016/17 

India was going for the win, at least that's what it looked like when we were batting - it's either boom or bust with that braindead "leader" at the helm! We've simply forgotten the art of digging in, I don't recall the last time when we fought & came back from behind to win/draw anything under him 

[Turning_track]

The seniors should handle more responsibility especially in batting instead we are watching towards Pant, Sundar, Gill for doing bulk of the job. Yes there were few unlucky dismissals for us in the first innings but except Pujara none of the senior stood up. The English side have been more than competitive in last couple of tours despite whatever final scoreline of the past suggests. They know the significance of putting up huge runs early on the board & they have a potent bowling line up as well.
Poor captaincy on the field was quite evident & there were weird tactics by Kohli on the field atleast I didn't expect that in our home test series of such high value from him. The batting & fielding coach need to pull up their socks & help the players in those respective areas. You cannot win a test match with glaring errors displayed in like the first test & later expect everything would be alright somehow. Plus playing 4 tests in only 2 venues was always going to help the Poms in the series. Last but not the least the part time curator needed a slap for preparing this **** pitch & yes I would have called the pitch was damn poor even if India had won the match.

Edited February 10, 2021 by Turning_track

[Sooda]

I did think too that Kuldeep should have been in, for Sundar in fact: but bear in mind the pitch was so slow, and he is pretty slow through the air anyway, even if he could not be read the batsmen would have ample time to play him... and not bowled in test cricket for ages, though you'd expect him to get rhythm back soonish