India: Covid - II

[Mariyam]

@jf1gp_1

 

I think it's very simple. We don't have a system in place because having a transparent system and SoP in place would mean that the entire profiteering that goes on with every tragedy is nullified. It suits the mafias in power to not have systems. To not have any accountability. That is the way they can curry favours from a whole host of competing sycophants for even the most basic of necessities like a hospital bed.

 

For a country that churns out a gazillion IT graduates every year why is it so difficult to have a live ticker that shows status of beds at various hospitals.? 

Rhetorical question. Clear answer is to create an artificial shortage and have people panic into spending a lot.

Avant garde extortion.

Edited May 21, 2021 by Mariyam

[ravishingravi]

One thing I have learnt and I try to follow as much I can is that dissent is absolutely essential in democracy. You have to be absolutely ruthlessly demanding and the set their feet on fire. But of course it works both ways. You don’t wear masks and asks for oxygen for 10 fold increase. Doesn’t work like that. I think we are expecting too much to change to quick. Vaccination is our best bet. 

[EnterTheVoid]

25 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

@jf1gp_1

 

I think it's very simple. We don't have a system in place because having a transparent system and SoP in place would mean that the entire profiteering that goes on with every tragedy is nullified. It suits the mafias in power to not have systems. To not have any accountability. That is the way they can curry favours from a whole host of competing sycophants for even the most basic of necessities like a hospital bed.

 

For a country that churns out gazillion IT graduates every year why is it so difficult to have a live ticker that shows status of beds at various hospitals. 

Rhetorical question. Clear answer is to create an artificial shortage and have people panic into spending a lot.

Avant garde extortion.

 

The system is working exactly as it was designed. 

 

To make money. Not to help people. 

[jf1gp_1]

6 minutes ago, ravishingravi said:

One thing I have learnt and I try to follow as much I can is that dissent is absolutely essential in democracy. You have to be absolutely ruthlessly demanding and the set their feet on fire. But of course it works both ways. You don’t wear masks and asks for oxygen for 10 fold increase. Doesn’t work like that. I think we are expecting too much to change to quick. Vaccination is our best bet. 

Sure, the day we start respecting ourselves is the day we will start getting more leaders than politicians.

[rkt.india]

1 hour ago, Mariyam said:

We don't blame authorities for us not wearing masks.

 

We blame them, and rightly so, for failing to provide any beds/oxygen/medicine/vaccines. We blame them for the fact that there is NO TRANSPARENCY on any of these and most people have to rely on twitter/IG to avail a bed. Or some random telegram group to know the status of vaccines in the city.

 

Case in point, the BMC website of beds availability was a sham when Mumbai was at 8-10k cases a day. And BMC helplines would direct you to specific private hospitals from which they would get a cut presumably.

 

The entire wave 2 has resulted in people having no trust in governments. Centre or State.

Had people followed covid protocols properly, they wouldn't have needed so many beds, oxygen, medicines. Both are inverse proportional. Expecting to provide such facilities to lacs of people is just irrational.

[Mariyam]

16 minutes ago, ravishingravi said:

One thing I have learnt and I try to follow as much I can is that dissent is absolutely essential in democracy. You have to be absolutely ruthlessly demanding and the set their feet on fire. But of course it works both ways. You don’t wear masks and asks for oxygen for 10 fold increase. Doesn’t work like that. I think we are expecting too much to change to quick. Vaccination is our best bet. 

Ravish, this is one of the very few times that you are off the mark.

 

The demand and (artificial shortage) for hospital beds has always been there even in non Covid times. Its just that Covid has brought it to *your* notice.

 

We run a manufacturing unit and by law our labour force is covered by the ESIS scheme for all health related issues for the workers and their immediate dependents. There are specific ESIS hospitals too.

 

There was a time when the wife of a worker had a difficult pregnancy. All the paper work was in order and the ESIS hospital refused to give a bed due to "lack of beds". We know that it's a bogus claim because we did ask around. The said hospital instead kept directing us to other hospitals which weren't covered in the scheme. Lot of time was lost in this process. The woman was finally admitted to some other hospital close to her residence and the baby had a near 15 day long incubation period. All of this was expensive for a worker to handle.

 

We filed an RTI to get the status of beds ( the application was done 10 days in advance, the hospital rejected the patient 2 days before the delivery) for that 15 day period. We are yet to receive a response. Or any threats.

 

Pleas do not tell me that there was no manufactured shortage earlier. This is how this mafia has always functioned.

Edited May 21, 2021 by Mariyam

[rkt.india]

1 minute ago, Mariyam said:

Ravish, this is one of the very few times that you are off the mark.

 

The demand for hospital beds has always been there even in non Covid times. Its just that Covid has brought it to *your* notice.

 

We run a manufacturing unit and by law our labour force is covered by the ESIS scheme for all health related issues for the workers and their immediate dependents. There are specific ESIS hospitals too.

 

There was a time when the wife of a worker had a difficult pregnancy. All the paper work was in order and the ESIS hospital refused to give a bed due to "lack of beds". They instead kept directing us to other hospitals which weren't covered in the scheme. Lot of time was lost in this process. The woman was finally admitted to some other hospital close to her residence and the baby had a near 15 day long incubation period. All of this was expensive for a worker to handle.

 

We filed an RTI to get the status of beds ( the application was done 10 days in advance, the hospital rejected the patient 2 days before the delivery) for that 15 day period. We are yet to receive a response. Or any threats.

 

Pleas do not tell me that there was no manufactured shortage earlier. This is how this mafia has always functioned.

So it wasn't the problem of lack of bed but problem of hospital not covered in ESIS.

[Mariyam]

15 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

So it wasn't the problem of lack of bed but problem of hospital not covered in ESIS.

Huh?

 

The problem was of an artificial shortage of beds when there was none. We had to settle for a non ESIS bed because we didn't get what was due to the workers' wife.

[Mariyam]

21 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Had people followed covid protocols properly, they wouldn't have needed so many beds, oxygen, medicines. Both are inverse proportional. Expecting to provide such facilities to lacs of people is just irrational.

No one is expecting lacs of beds. What people are expecting is honesty on the status of beds. Honesty on the status of medicines and their availability. And a system where these beds can be booked easily without people (especially the poor ones) having to run from one hospital to another in rickshaws only to be turned away.

[mishra]

16 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

Huh?

 

The problem was of an artificial shortage of beds when there was none. We had to settle for a non ESIS bed because we didn't get what was due to the workers' wife.

So why are you(law) waiting on RTI? What if RTI wasn’t there? Shouldn’t patient get massive compensation. Why does it matters if beds are free or not? Contract was breached. Hospital should have thought about it before going into contract..

 

Not a lawyer, so asking it as genuine question.

Edited May 21, 2021 by mishra

[Mariyam]

28 minutes ago, mishra said:

So why are you(law) waiting on RTI? What if RTI wasn’t there? Shouldn’t patient get massive compensation. Why does it matters if beds are free or not? Contract was breached. Hospital should have thought about it before going into contract..

 

Not a lawyer, so asking it as genuine question.

Its a breach of a contract if service is denied when it was possible to provide service.

 

The said hospital gave a letter saying that there are no beds. Ideally this letter can be used in other allied hospitals to claim a refund on procedures and other expenses. But the allied hospitals needed a certain number of days (mainly to process paper work) as intimation and some of them claimed to not have any beds themselves.

 

Hence the person in contention had to go to a private hospital as a last resort.

[Mariyam]

4 hours ago, ravishingravi said:

Its improving everyday guys. Hopefully all goes on track by end of June we should be back to Jan numbers. Hope and pray the worst is over. 

With the current level of lockdown?

 

Or even if things are opened up?

[speedheat]

 

[speedheat]

 

 

[coffee_rules]

On 5/20/2021 at 7:09 AM, G_B_ said:

Maharashtra is total fudging...as i said before in order to hide the shame of mumbai they spread patients to other cities. Pure politics from the shiv sena. I have relatives in both mumbai and ozer. The people from ozer said they usually went to nashik for medical help. This time it was blocked by mumbai patients. 

 

The epi centre of maharashtra continues to remain amravati district which incidentally was centre of farmer protests. This is why nagpur bore a bigger brunt this time. 

 

Even brilliant kerala model. Was speaking to a friend from kerala who told me north kerala was heavily dependent on mangalore in karnataka facilities. Had karnataka shut the borders gods own country would be gods own graveyard.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maha model: Blame the journalists for fudging #s

 

[Vilander]

6 hours ago, ravishingravi said:

TN has highest balance as on 18 th May. How can there is be balance and shortage at the same time @Vilander

This is latest news. Which means there is finally good supply. 1.3 mil doses

[Vilander]

Looks like it's cowin portal they should just distribute to multiple clinical facilities and open up to 18 + 

 

 

 

 

[Mariyam]

On 5/18/2021 at 10:28 PM, kepler37b said:

 

Is it NOT across India? There are towns in AP which have population in lakhs, but NOT a single ICU bed. 

From what I gather:

The general guidelines from the centre pre Co-Vid were to have 80 beds per 100,000 people.

And 4 ICU beds per 100,000 people.

 

None of the States met their target,apart from Mizoram.  And its a very low target compared to public health statistics even in nations like Philippines and Indonesia, leave aside the West.

The All India statistic here is 2.4 ICU beds per 100,000 people. And it is heavily skewed towards the Metros.

 

The State governments had the freedom to set aside whatever ratio of beds for Covid Usage based on the severity of the disease in the area. Most Jumbo Centres/ Covid centres were created/reactivated after we were well into the wave and not pro-actively. 

The statistics on doctors/100,000 people and Doctors on Covid duty / 100,000 people are even more abysmal. It shows incompetence and indifference at best. 

 

I don't understand why so many on this thread want to guilt trip people into believing that their lack of discipline has caused this situation. That is a minor contributor at best. We are a densely populated country where many people don't have a WFH luxury. They have to step out to work and there will be transmission. Even with a year to prepare for waves/fallouts our governments and the entire administrative set up have failed. Period.

 

 

 

[Number]

@Vilander

 

 

It seems there is huge vaccine hesitancy in TN.

[mishra]

58 minutes ago, Mariyam said:

Its a breach of a contract if service is denied when it was possible to provide service.

 

The said hospital gave a letter saying that there are no beds. Ideally this letter can be used in other allied hospitals to claim a refund on procedures and other expenses. But the allied hospitals needed a certain number of days (mainly to process paper work) as intimation and some of them claimed to not have any beds themselves.

 

Hence the person in contention had to go to a private hospital as a last resort.

Then law is wrong. Why blame hospital. For example corporates have open tickets with airlines. If they need it honoured, Airline honours them by giving some deal to some random passenger who takes the deal and vacates his seat.