'Asia Cup thrashing against India started the downfall of Pakistani fast bowlers' - Ramiz Raja

[Tillu]

Former Pakistan cricketer and ex-PCB chair Ramiz Raja feels the reputation of Pakistan’s fast bowling has deteriorated, with their downfall starting from the massive Super Fours defeat against India during last year’s Asia Cup. Raja shared his views after Pakistan lost the first Test against Bangladesh on Sunday (August 25) in Rawalpindi.

Pakistan succumbed to a a first ever defeat against Bangladesh, by 10 wickets in the first Test of the two-match series, in Rawalpindi. What made the loss even more humiliating was that Pakistan declared at 448-6 in the first innings, and after the fourth day of play, a certain draw was on the cards on a pitch which had little to offer for the bowlers.

Speaking on his YouTube channel, Ramiz didn’t mince his words while criticising the hosts on the loss. He also questioned Pakistan’s decision to go with an all-pace attack as Bangladesh batted for 167.3 overs to rack up 565 in their first innings, raising doubts over the team selection. He also opined that Pakistan’s current crop of fast bowlers is not up to mark.

"Firstly, there was a mistake in team selection. You were without a spinner. Secondly, the reputation based on which we rely on our fast bowlers is finished. This debacle, a sort of a confidence crisis, started during the Asia Cup when India bashed our pacers on seaming conditions and then the secret was out to the world that the only way to counter this line-up was to attack," said Ramiz. "Their speeds have decreased, and so have their skill set."

During the 2023 Asia Cup, India scored 356-2, courtesy of massive hundreds from Virat Kohli (122 not out off 94 balls) and KL Rahul (111 not out off 106). In reply, Pakistan were bowled out for 128, suffering their heaviest ODI defeat against India.

Ramiz added: "The Bangladesh fast bowlers seemed more penetrative, while our bowlers were involved more in enjoying the dismissals and creating drama around them rather than impressing with their performances. The speeds of Pakistan's fast bowlers are less. If you don’t have an out-and-out fast bowler on this pitch and only have one-dimensional 125 to 135 kmph pacers, a batting line-up like Bangladesh will stand tall against you."

 

Wisden

[Tillu]

Must have included the Asia cup thrashing to garner more views for his video.

[Austin 3:!6]

That 228 runs defeat in Asia cup was indeed humiliating. After that game, Indian openers always play freely against Pak fast bowlers. For the period between WT20 2021 till Asia Cup 2023, there was a fear of failure. 

 

However, that game had no impact on Pakistani test bowling. They were a trash test side even when Ramiz was chairman. Pakistan has not won a test match at home since Aug 2021

 

 

[Ultimate_Game]

Known thing and I had a post on it that India totally disintegrated Pak mentally after that 230 run defeat. That hammering took all the air out of Pak balloon, and they haven't been the same since.

 

Before that match we heard all sorts of things from Pak fans, cricketers, and ex-cricketers such as "India can't play Pak pacers", "India is afraid of playing Pak", "we'll beat India in India and win the WC", "we're one of the favorites of the world cup". All that went out of the window after that game. In fact if the previous match had been played where Pak to chase 260 in 42 overs, that would've resulted in another 120+ run thrashing but in brainless Pak fans' mind it was India who managed to escape defeat 

 

Now things are so bad they shake in their boots at facing India and so mentally scarred and disintegrated that even likes of Steve Waugh and Allan Border would be proud of the number India has done on Pak 

[vvvslaxman]

Yea they are so terrified that they got owned even by H1b Indians

[tapandrun]

Not sure what is he talking, Pak team has been poor in Odis and Tests for a v.long time. Last good proper test match winner was Ajmal.

T20 was Paks best format that too they are playing 150-160 kind of matches and their bowling has been really good in terms of pulling back and getting the over the lines.

Pak bowlers were bowling their fastest and best during that period and it made them look like a good t20 side. Both Ind and Pak are least exciting t20i sides. The other winning streaks were during the ODI wc cycles when most teams were not concerned about t20s and were focusing on ODis more.

 

Not sure why Ind has been playing so many close matches to Pak in t20s, rest all the teams ranked lower then Pak team fancy their chances against them.

 

During the peak they had the best t20 bowling line template if a team is lacking a mystery spinner or someone like Pathirana/Malinga who are wkt takers being economical.

Once the wheels were off of the bowling Pak batting had nothing the best t20 batter Pak has is Fakkar who is not opening.

 

Now that T20s have changed alot and at rapid rate Pak team are caught behind the race. Shaheen and Babar/Rizwan are overhyped on their performances against some A/B/C sides. Is Babar a good batter yes but is he a match-winner ??? Shaheen is looking v.ordinary after losing the pace post-injury. Before injury he had pace and was bowling full and nailing yorker well, that's all he had never had good bouncer or channel bowing/seam/no-indipper nothing so losing the pace made batters able to take his attempted yorkers as full tosses and flick them. 

Rauf has role of being an middle over enforcer and run stopper in the end over, but since the team is not able to pick wkts upfront he is not been able to enforce anything.

Batters are well settled, they are not in 2 minds to play him out or try to score some runs and when a settled batters know there are only 3 kind of balls that are coming his way they are able to pick and chose which balls to hit and which to defend.

 

Shadaab is no longer bowler he once was and then Naseem was bowling quick at v.good pace and length, but it was matter of time of him getting injured, for a not so tall bowler he was getting bounce of the awkward length putting pressure on shoulders and elbow also looks like his action can be detrimental to his back too. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 26 by tapandrun

[singhvivek141]

After the "Namaz" statement by Bekar Younus. It seems everything for Pakistan has gone to ****.

Can this be considered as "Qudrat ka Nizaam" ?

 

[Adamant]

So basically Kohli is responsible for it.

All Hail!

122(94)* destroyed Pakistani pacers.

[Adamant]

18 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

Known thing and I had a post on it that India totally disintegrated Pak mentally after that 230 run defeat. That hammering took all the air out of Pak balloon, and they haven't been the same since.

 

Before that match we heard all sorts of things from Pak fans, cricketers, and ex-cricketers such as "India can't play Pak pacers", "India is afraid of playing Pak", "we'll beat India in India and win the WC", "we're one of the favorites of the world cup". All that went out of the window after that game. In fact if the previous match had been played where Pak to chase 260 in 42 overs, that would've resulted in another 120+ run thrashing but in brainless Pak fans' mind it was India who managed to escape defeat 

 

Now things are so bad they shake in their boots at facing India and so mentally scarred and disintegrated that even likes of Steve Waugh and Allan Border would be proud of the number India has done on Pak 

Yes, Kohli did that, thanks for confirming.

[Austin 3:!6]

1 hour ago, Adamant said:

So basically Kohli is responsible for it.

All Hail!

122(94)* destroyed Pakistani pacers.

 

Nope...it was Shubhman Gill. He stepped out and took charge against Shaheen Afridi and thrashed him all over the park.

 

Kohli took advantage the next day of an already depleted bowling attack missing Haris Rauf due to injury.

 

I am a Kohli fan too but no need to brag him everytime

[R!TTER]

Pak's downfall is a continuous process for at least 20-30 years! As much as BRat's paid bots or Ramiz would like to claim, this isn't down to just one game 

[Sean Bradley]

Downfall can be termed when someone is on the peak or on the Prime or lets say the best in the world. They were never on top to fall down, they were down, now they are in drains. 

Edited August 27 by Sean Bradley

[vvvslaxman]

1 hour ago, R!TTER said:

Pak's downfall is a continuous process for at least 20-30 years! As much as BRat's paid bots or Ramiz would like to claim, this isn't down to just one game 

 

When all the "short cut" methods employed b y Pakistan were caught on camera they got exposed gradually. They had to work a lot harder to win matches.  Once tampering, chucking, biased umpiring got eliminated Pakistan started declining. 

[Chaos]

17 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

When all the "short cut" methods employed b y Pakistan were caught on camera they got exposed gradually. They had to work a lot harder to win matches.  Once tampering, chucking, biased umpiring got eliminated Pakistan started declining. 

declining? U meant say “completely declined and below minnow level”.

 

our IT CODER, owned pakistan. That was the death date of pook cricket. Loss against USA IT coders.

[Ultimate_Game]

4 hours ago, Adamant said:

Yes, Kohli did that, thanks for confirming.

 

Bhai tu mandir bane le Kohli ka aur aarti utara kar uski.

 

Kohli and KL scored in that match after Rohit & Gill's onslaught. Go ahead and watch the match again. Rohit & Gill scored 120+ for the opening wkt in 16 overs. The match was done and dusted there itself and if Kohli and middle order couldn't even capitalize on that start, he should probably give up playing cricket.

[Adamant]

37 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Bhai tu mandir bane le Kohli ka aur aarti utara kar uski.

 

Kohli and KL scored in that match after Rohit & Gill's onslaught. Go ahead and watch the match again. Rohit & Gill scored 120+ for the opening wkt in 16 overs. The match was done and dusted there itself and if Kohli and middle order couldn't even capitalize on that start, he should probably give up playing cricket.

Lol, har post mai aukaad dikha dete ho.

Rohit and Gill played with 110 str rate .

Kohli scored at 130 and carried India to 356, no the match wasn’t done and dusted 

[Haarkarjeetgaye]

use thrashing bola kya. Nahi nahi foreplay bola hoga 

[Ultimate_Game]

1 hour ago, Adamant said:

Lol, har post mai aukaad dikha dete ho.

Rohit and Gill played with 110 str rate .

Kohli scored at 130 and carried India to 356, no the match wasn’t done and dusted 

 

Shows all about your cricketing acumen... Bigging up a player who came in when openers had already scored 120 in 16 overs. If a no. 3 can't even capitalize on that, they should quit.

 

Unfortunately the said player was nowhere to be seen when was needed in 2015 SF, 2019 WC SF, 2023 Final when a contribution was actually needed.

[Haarkarjeetgaye]

27 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Shows all about your cricketing acumen... Bigging up a player who came in when openers had already scored 120 in 16 overs. If a no. 3 can't even capitalize on that, they should quit.

 

Unfortunately the said player was nowhere to be seen when was needed in 2015 SF, 2019 WC SF, 2023 Final when a contribution was actually needed.

Ponting also came in at 120 and took the score to 369. 2003 final 

[MechEng]

9 hours ago, Haarkarjeetgaye said:

Ponting also came in at 120 and took the score to 369. 2003 final 

 

That game is etched in my memory forever.

 

But the worst humiliation India had to endure in my long years of following the game has to be the 4-0 thrashing in England. Nothing comes close.