kosingh Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 ICF does get a bit carried away by Ranji and IPL performances. I am sure if there is a player that a captain the stature of Kohli really wants, he will be drafted into the squad. The best talent will pick themselves, and some of the marginal talent will be in, and some will be out. That's just how it is, unfortunately. I can fault the selectors for the occasional nepotism pick. But selections is a damn hard job, and there will always be complaints no matter what squad you pick. You don't have to be on ICF for long to know how often we get the selections wrong. Many here have clamored for the likes of Karn Sharma and Axar Patel before they made their debut. And when they were finally selected, we see they weren't quite what ICF believed they would be. All of us think we are experts of the game. But the reality is, we ain't know nothing. tweaker, sandeep, Unleashed and 1 other 4
Ankit_sharma03 Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 1 minute ago, kosingh said: ICF does get a bit carried away by Ranji and IPL performances. I am sure if there is a player that a captain the stature of Kohli really wants, he will be drafted into the squad. The best talent will pick themselves, and some of the marginal talent will be in, and some will be out. That's just how it is, unfortunately. I can fault the selectors for the occasional nepotism pick. But selections is a damn hard job, and there will always be complaints no matter what squad you pick. You don't have to be on ICF for long to know how often we get the selections wrong. Many here have clamored for the likes of Karn Sharma and Axar Patel before they made their debut. And when they were finally selected, we see they weren't quite what ICF believed they would be. All of us think we are experts of the game. But the reality is, we ain't know nothing. They both got selected and we saw how good or bad they are- Until u wont try how wud u know. We rated Pandya, rahul, Bumrah also highly and they have come good Some would come good some wont but until u try how wud u knw. Some players have a lot of potential but they cant overcome the international pressure to . So u cant judge by everyone by same yardsticks tweaker 1
Bleed-Blue Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 35 minutes ago, King Tendulkar said: To me the modern one we not tapping in to is Aaron Been injured all season.
Cricketics Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 7 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said: They both got selected and we saw how good or bad they are- Until u wont try how wud u know. We rated Pandya, rahul, Bumrah also highly and they have come good Some would come good some wont but until u try how wud u knw. Some players have a lot of potential but they cant overcome the international pressure to . So u cant judge by everyone by same yardsticks I think his post is talking about general thing about how certain players are backed here to an extent that some beleive that they are better players than the ones playing for certain scenarios but they end up not performing as well as people have claimed about them. For example things like people wanting Rahane dropped from test side recently after just few failures but his replacements, which could be any player claimed to be extremely good, ends up not doing as good as even Rahane. One thing is backing a player who has not played and other things like claiming to be the best replacement for current player without even having seen players at the same level for considerable time. That is what he meant when he said "carried away." tweaker and kosingh 2
express bowling Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 (edited) 43 minutes ago, kosingh said: ICF does get a bit carried away by Ranji and IPL performances. I am sure if there is a player that a captain the stature of Kohli really wants, he will be drafted into the squad. The best talent will pick themselves, and some of the marginal talent will be in, and some will be out. That's just how it is, unfortunately. I can fault the selectors for the occasional nepotism pick. But selections is a damn hard job, and there will always be complaints no matter what squad you pick. You don't have to be on ICF for long to know how often we get the selections wrong. Many here have clamored for the likes of Karn Sharma and Axar Patel before they made their debut. And when they were finally selected, we see they weren't quite what ICF believed they would be. All of us think we are experts of the game. But the reality is, we ain't know nothing. People on ICF do not get to see most FC or List A games and miss most A team games too. Selectors are paid to watch most of these games and are supposed to have special qualifications for spotting international cricket talent. Can't compare the two really. How would Kohli or Dhoni or any other team India captain know about all the possible budding talents in our country , as they do not play much domestic cricket these days ? All players selected won't do well.....that is a given as temperament suitable for international cricket can't be gauged either by the selectors or by the fans, till the players actually play in international matches. We may not know much....does not matter really, but questions arise regarding selection when there are weaknesses in team composition for a long time but new players are not introduced to these positions....like lower order high SR batters in LOIs these days. Questions also arise when some players are failing for a long time but new alternatives are not introduced. Edited January 16, 2017 by express bowling Mosher and tweaker 2
Brainfade Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 A fundamental issue is that numbers in domestics don't seem to be a good predictor of international success, and there is a lot of subjectivity that goes into selections. This is true especially in the case of fast bowlers. The guys with the highest number of wickets (or even lowest bowling avg) are the steady, line and length "trundlers" who don't pan out at the international level. With batsmen, very few of the domestic grinders pan out. That leaves us with two options: (1) the eye test: This is about the only way one can identify fast bowlers, it seems. And keyboard selectors have no hope here because we can go only by numbers. Selectors must identify them after 1 - 2 seasons when they are young, fast and raw, and draft them before the rigors of multiple domestic seasons wear them out. It takes a lot of experience and objectivity on the part of the talent-spotters to successfully distinguish the real talents and bring them in at the right time. (2) dominance: At least here, keyboard selectors like us have some hope of identifying good batsmen. Not only should they have great averages (> 55), but must be ones who dominate domestic attacks (SR =/> 60) in FC games. The guys who consistently score 100s at a 40 SR are great, but will simply not survive international cricket. tweaker 1
goose Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 New faces are playing starring roles for India. Yadav, Nair, Jadhav. Someone's doing something right. tweaker 1
SecondSlip Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 Cheteshwar Pujara in ODI cricket. Averages 50+ in List A cricket but was never given a chance. tweaker and MCcricket 2
coffee_rules Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 A thin line between 'giving a longer rope' to some and 'roping in new blood'. Some players will get unlucky. For eg. any MO batsman in the sidelines between 1997-2008 had to wait for fab 4 to vanish. Other openers during Sehwag/Gambhir days. Spinners during 70s when spin quartet were in play. Can't blame the selectors for all such instances. At least now, there are U-19 and 'A' teams for international exposure, they can increase the bench strength by giving chances to new players on every chance. But calling back oldies that have been tried and tested is what falls on selectors and captains/coach. We have some captains who form a coterie of players that want their favorite players back.
tweaker Posted January 17, 2017 Author Posted January 17, 2017 The most recent shocking selections from selectors was during the practice games against England. The selectors choose Vinay Kumar,Dinda,Mohit Sharma in the squad.The selector had a great opputunity in giving some young pacers a chance to showcase their skiils against a strong batting unit.In our squad we lack a left arm fast bowler.Selectors should have seen this oppurtunity & should have selected couple of left arms pacers in the 2 squads. In this 2 practice matches youngsters Kuldeep & Pant showed they are ready for the next level. Laaloo, express bowling, MCcricket and 1 other 4
express bowling Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 5 hours ago, goose said: New faces are playing starring roles for India. Yadav, Nair, Jadhav. Someone's doing something right. Dravid......has done an excellent job identifying and developing players with international potential rather than going by just FC numbers. In the A team and U19 teams, he has promoted pacers with pace and spinners with spin. Tried to pick good all-rounders and some good batters with solid games. His suggestions to Kumble for our national team have been excellent..... Pandya, Jayant and Nair. Kumble has acknowledged this fact. Listening to players like Dravid, Ganguly, Laxman and Zaheer.....the players they identify for our national team or the ones they back after introduction....they are usually much better than run-of-the-mill selectors' picks. tweaker and Mosher 2
gakgupta Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 55 minutes ago, tweaker said: The most recent shocking selections from selectors was during the practice games against England. The selectors choose Vinay Kumar,Dinda,Mohit Sharma in the squad.The selector had a great opputunity in giving some young pacers a chance to showcase their skiils against a strong batting unit.In our squad we lack a left arm fast bowler.Selectors should have seen this oppurtunity & should have selected couple of left arms pacers in the 2 squads. In this 2 practice matches youngsters Kuldeep & Pant showed they are ready for the next level. Kuldeep and pant are under selectors radar.....MSK prasad has already mentioned it..... Let them have couple of domestic seasons....Even-though, the standard is not great, they will learn a lot..... Although, Kuldeep is good, he still have a learn the art and he can do that peacefully in the pressure free environment. tweaker 1
Unleashed Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 There's this big obsession here to fast track every young player who has performed well in one season of Ranji trophy. Fact is that this selection committee is pretty good. Jayant Yadav and Karun Nair were pretty good selections, many would've preferred Kuldeep and Iyer ahead of them. Similarly, they fast tracked Pandya in the test squad inspite of the fact that his selection was criticised earlier. If they see a ridiculous talent then he'll be fast tracked case in point, Rishabh Pant. GoldenSun and tweaker 2
amits Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 It would be a very long list if we start to count even from 1990s Amol Muzumdar, Mithun Manhas, Subramaniam Badrinath, Vijay Bharadwaj, Shitanshu Kotak, Ranadeb Bose, Shiv Shankar Paul, Ashish Winston Zaidi Murali Kartik got chances, but was never a regular as Kumble & Harbhajan were at their prime
Lannister Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Its baffling to see that no media outlet is willing to cover this issue. Had it been the case with Australian and English boards, their media would've ripped them apart by now.
kosingh Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Good article on rediff listing the players who have played the least amount of matches under the last few captains. Here is part of the article, showing the figure under Dhoni: Players Matches Wasim Jaffer 1 Wriddhiman Saha 1 Sourabh Tiwary 1 Sreenath Aravind 1 Karn Sharma 1 Pankaj Singh 2 Ramesh Powar 2 Parvinder Awana 2 Manpreet Gony 2 Ajit Agarkar 3 Abhishek Nayar 3 Rahul Sharma 4 Jaydev Unadkat 4 Joginder Sharma 4 Subramaniam Badrinath 5 Abhinav Mukund 5 Sudeep Tyagi 5 Lakhmipathy Balaji 6 Abhimanyu Mithun 6 Murali Kartik 8 Manoj Tiwary 8 Varun Aaron 9 Dhawal Kulkarni 9 Lokesh Rahul 9 Stuart Binny 10 Entire article: http://www.rediff.com/cricket/report/if-dhoni-didnt-care-for-you-as-a-player-then/20170117.htm No one really stands out as particularly unfortunate not to have played more. If players who have played 1-10 matches don't appear too unfortunate, I somehow doubt there are too many players who played zero matches who have been screwed. Sooner or later the deserving ones will get their chance. sandeep 1
rkt.india Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 17 hours ago, SUMO said: we need to revamp our list A domestics it shouldn't take 10 years for a guy to play 100 list A games otherwise we wont find guys like kedar at young age there should be 20 games a year at least our domestic cricketers play very less matches in comparison to England domestic cricketers.
rkt.india Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 10 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said: They both got selected and we saw how good or bad they are- Until u wont try how wud u know. We rated Pandya, rahul, Bumrah also highly and they have come good Some would come good some wont but until u try how wud u knw. Some players have a lot of potential but they cant overcome the international pressure to . So u cant judge by everyone by same yardsticks and Axar too has done very good in ODI cricket. We played Karn Sharma in tests which wasnt his best format.
rkt.india Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 11 hours ago, King Tendulkar said: To me the modern one we not tapping in to is Aaron both Aaron and Umesh are hopeless cases.
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