Not sure if Kohli is a long-term captaincy option - Graeme Smith

[mancalledsting]

36 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

So will indian cricket go nowere 

Very innacurate remark....dominant home record (drew/lost corresponding series at home under previous captain), rejuvenated pace attack (which was at lowest point of modern era), improved fitness standards and Indian cricket has gone nowhere.....? 

Edited January 23, 2018 by mancalledsting

[Ankit_sharma03]

11 minutes ago, mancalledsting said:

Very innacurate remark....dominant home record (drew/lost corresponding series at home under previous captain), rejuvenated pace attack (which was at lowest point of modern era), improved fitness standards and Indian cricket has gone nowhere.....? 

Improved fitness was a reason i wanted kohli to be captain n he has done well on that mark 

But it cant be only about that 

We were dominating under dhoni also at home and wud under next captain also. 

Indian cricket has reached a certain level where it is a good and consistent team but what about the next level ....to aim to be best .....that where i dnt see ourselfs going

 

We are not using our best resources

1. The best batsman after kohli - KL rahul look how is he treated 

2. With so much talent coming up- how many are getting chances. Now u do understand upcoming talent will only makenur team better

3. We have gone back in circle with yuvi, gambhir, bhajji, kartthik , parthiv when we have a huge bunch of talented players

4. We still havent learned who does well in what condition n what format

Rahane struggles in LOI

Dhoni - t20

Rohit dhawan- overseas test 

5. slip catching has gone to gutters 

6. we are repeating same mistakes again n again

7. we were suppose to be aggressive instead we have become conservative 

 

If we have improved in certain areas well we have fallen in others. Just becoz teams around the world arent that good anymore doesnt mean we need to be happy with mediocrity 

 

Start watching a lot of domestic A-games and ull understand where we shud be with those players if added and where we are with same bunch of players. 

Edited January 23, 2018 by Ankit_sharma03

[bhakum20]

Replace Kohli with Graeme Smith, one of the great captains, and the result will be the same. Yes he made selection blunders, but I doubt the benched batsmen would've made a difference.

In SA's conducive conditions his bowling captaincy hasn't come to the fore yet. Wait till we get to Australia and AUS is 300/0 with our bowlers failing to bowl to the right lengths there/slips dropping catches.

The captain cannot be blamed if his players cannot adjust to overseas conditions. That requires proactive planning from BCCI itself, but since we know they're not serious about Tests, nothing will happen.

I'm just wondering why I wasted my time typing the obvious, but some people here are deluded to think that any other result would've been possible.

Edited January 23, 2018 by bhakum20

[vvvslaxman]

First of all i am not going to question his commitment to the team. He has desire to win. He wants to take the side to next level.  He is not laidback like someone like Azharuddin, Vengsarkar when they were captains. As a captain you have to BUILD a core unit. You have to involve them in the thinking process. At this point he is like a bird with clipped wings in Tests. There is no Dhoni to run to. Instead of boosting confidence of his own players he is killing it with indifferent selection. Having an aggressive attitude does not mean looking angry all the time. If anything it is counter-productive.  Good thing is this is all fixable. He has some of the best brains in the game. Rahane, Ashwin, Pujara, Bhuvi are all very smart, intelligent cricketers. Rahul is future. Include all of these guys in the process of decision making as and when needed. If he keeps resting them on a regular basis their role will be limited to save their own places rather than collectively contributing to the team at all level.

[Detonator]

1 hour ago, Muloghonto said:

Err actually I think India has a very easy option to replace Kohli in the test side as captain: a player who is just as 'undroppable' as Kohli is at the moment - Ashwin. 

Ashwin is shrewd as *. 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/sports/cricket/news/sometimes-virat-kohli-is-so-aggressive-i-feel-a-bit-scared-r-ashwin/articleshow/58090621.cms 

 

The way he ended the careers of naraine, shillingford, senayake, and padosi ajmal, he brings a different form of aggressiveness. More like srini mama

[kira]

42 minutes ago, bhakum20 said:

Replace Kohli with Graeme Smith, one of the great captains, and the result will be the same. Yes he made selection blunders, but I doubt the benched batsmen would've made a difference.

In SA's conducive conditions his bowling captaincy hasn't come to the fore yet. Wait till we get to Australia and AUS is 300/0 with our bowlers failing to bowl to the right lengths there/slips dropping catches.

The captain cannot be blamed if his players cannot adjust to overseas conditions. That requires proactive planning from BCCI itself, but since we know they're not serious about Tests, nothing will happen.

I'm just wondering why I wasted my time typing the obvious, but some people here are deluded to think that any other result would've been possible.

This. Captaincy role comes into play during fielding and we've done amazingly well in the bowling department (sure our catching needs a major improvement and he deserves to be criticized on that front) but the captain can't do much if our top order bats like tailenders, we've taken all 40 south african wickets in this series so far and this has been one of the greatest bowling performance by India despite the dropped catches. If only we had batted better we would've have been 2-0 up instead of being 2-0 down. 

 

Kohli has taken India's fast bowling department to a different level, Indian team's body language under kohli has been on a different level when compared to dhoni era, we've never dominated to this extent even at home under previous captains, kohli's "go for the win in every situation" attitude is a massive upgrade from the pathetic dhoni era when we meekly settled for a draw chasing around 100-150 in 50 overs in windies despite being 1-0 up in the series. Kohli is a great captain and a LEADER, sure he has his flaws but he will only improve with experience and anyone who wants kohli removed as captain has a cricketing IQ in the negative

Edited January 23, 2018 by kira

[mancalledsting]

1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Improved fitness was a reason i wanted kohli to be captain n he has done well on that mark 

But it cant be only about that 

We were dominating under dhoni also at home and wud under next captain also. 

Indian cricket has reached a certain level where it is a good and consistent team but what about the next level ....to aim to be best .....that where i dnt see ourselfs going

 

We are not using our best resources

1. The best batsman after kohli - KL rahul look how is he treated 

2. With so much talent coming up- how many are getting chances. Now u do understand upcoming talent will only makenur team better

3. We have gone back in circle with yuvi, gambhir, bhajji, kartthik , parthiv when we have a huge bunch of talented players

4. We still havent learned who does well in what condition n what format

Rahane struggles in LOI

Dhoni - t20

Rohit dhawan- overseas test 

5. slip catching has gone to gutters 

6. we are repeating same mistakes again n again

7. we were suppose to be aggressive instead we have become conservative 

 

If we have improved in certain areas well we have fallen in others. Just becoz teams around the world arent that good anymore doesnt mean we need to be happy with mediocrity 

 

Start watching a lot of domestic A-games and ull understand where we shud be with those players if added and where we are with same bunch of players. 

sorry didn't bother to read rest of your post after this factual error/statement of false equivalence:

 

"We were dominating under dhoni also at home"

 

Erm sorry...lets look at records at home against world's best teams

Dhoni vs England 

 

1-0 Win 

1-2 Loss (first loss at home to England in 30 years, shortly after they got whitewashed vs Pak in UAE)

Kohli vs England 

 

4-0 Win 

 

Dhoni vs NZ

 

1-0 Win 

2-0 Win 

 

Kohli vs NZ

 

3-0 Win 

 

Dhoni vs South Africa 

 

1-1 Draw 

Kohli vs South Africa 

 

3-0 Win 

 

Dhoni vs Australia 

 

2-0 Win 

 

4-0 Win 

 

Kohli vs Australia 

 

2-1 Win (although didn't captain in last game of the series)

 

 

Australia aside (where Kohli hasn't even captained a full series at home), Virat Kohli clearly comes out on top in 3 out of 4 home tussles vs the big 4. Taking Indian dominance at home to a new level. Are you not aware of the record setting test undefeated streak. I'm just surprised at everyone's shameless attempts here to brush recent history under the carpet....

 

 

 

[kira]

39 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

He has some of the best brains in the game. Rahane, Ashwin, Pujara, Bhuvi are all very smart, intelligent cricketers. 

F%CK Pujara, he's one of the dumbest and most overrated home track bully cricket has ever seen, my hate for pujara has reached new levels since those runnouts, why is this guy so highly rated anyway? He average freaking 27 outside asia

[mancalledsting]

3 minutes ago, kira said:

F%CK Pujara, he's one of the dumbest and most overrated home track bully cricket has ever seen, my hate for pujara has reached new levels since those runnouts, why is this guy so highly rated anyway? He average freaking 27 outside asia

nahin yaar, Pujara was basically Viv Richards on previous round of overseas tours....Kohli's dominant personality turned him into the Gujrati equivalent of Inzamaam. 

Edited January 23, 2018 by mancalledsting

[Rasgulla]

6 minutes ago, mancalledsting said:

sorry didn't bother to read rest of your post after this factual error/statement of false equivalence

 We dominated at Home under every single captain other than Sachin who got whitewashed by saffers at home 

 

Stick that baised stats up your....

 

 

 

 

[mancalledsting]

1 minute ago, Rasgulla said:

 We dominated at Home under every single captain other than Sachin who got whitewashed by saffers at home 

 

Stick that baised stats up your....

 

 

 

 

either you're lying or you are genuinely stupid...in your case, the jury is out on both

[Rasgulla]

Just now, mancalledsting said:

either you're lying or you are genuinely stupid...in your case, the jury is out on both

Lying about whitewash ? No need to be touchy.. Accept the truth  that "Ailiaa" is a disgrace for the word "Captain" 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_African_cricket_team_in_India_in_1999–2000

 

 

 

[vvvslaxman]

8 minutes ago, kira said:

F%CK Pujara, he's one of the dumbest and most overrated home track bully cricket has ever seen, my hate for pujara has reached new levels since those runnouts, why is this guy so highly rated anyway? He average freaking 27 outside asia

Actually his captaincy was good with his A team. He did very well with his resources also batted well as a captain. Rightnow problem they are not gelling as a unit. The run outs are horrendous. But i cannot help wonder whether Kohli's dig at Pujara's slow scoring played any role. You never know.

[putrevus]

What about Gavaskars critism? 

I don’t know what captaincy mistakes he has done during this series, his team has competed hard and have been outplayed because his team’s batting has been awful.

Non selection of Rahane is in hindsight, series loss will not be devastating for Indian team in long run.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mancalledsting]

7 minutes ago, Rasgulla said:

Lying about whitewash ? No need to be touchy.. Accept the truth  that "Ailiaa" is a disgrace for the word "Captain" 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_African_cricket_team_in_India_in_1999–2000

 

 

 

again, never said Sachin was a good captain. Why do you keep telling me this? Wait a minute don't answer that...because if you had to rely on the truth to make your points, you'd have shut up 3 months ago

[Tattieboy]

2 minutes ago, putrevus said:

I don’t know what captaincy mistakes he has done during this series, his team has competed hard and have been outplayed because his team’s batting has been awful.

Non selection of Rahane is in hindsight, series loss will not be devastating for Indian team in long run.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I am speaking about your criticism of Graeme Smith but none of Sunil Gavaskar who critizised Kohli too. 

[Sean Bradley]

Been saying this all along, In the history of Indian Cricket, the best player has never been the best captain, Rohit Sharma should be made the ODI Captan, since Rahane's Test Career is uncertain at the moment, there is no real replacement of Kohli in Tests, which is a worrying sign.

[vvvslaxman]

Just now, Sean Bradley said:

Been saying this all along, In the history of Indian Cricket, the best player has never been the best captain, Rohit Sharma should be made the ODI Captan, since Rahane's Test Career is uncertain at the moment, there is no real replacement of Kohli in Tests, which is a worrying sign.

Rohit sharma's place should be uncertain instead of Rahane's place. That is where Kohli draws lot of criticism. An year ago Rahane was part of nucleus for years to come. Now he can't find a place in playing XI.  Pandya's inclusion means they have to sacrifice a batsman. Between Rohit and Rahane he went with Rohit.

[mishra]

2 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

First of all i am not going to question his commitment to the team. He has desire to win. He wants to take the side to next level.  He is not laidback like someone like Azharuddin, Vengsarkar when they were captains. As a captain you have to BUILD a core unit. You have to involve them in the thinking process. At this point he is like a bird with clipped wings in Tests. There is no Dhoni to run to. Instead of boosting confidence of his own players he is killing it with indifferent selection. Having an aggressive attitude does not mean looking angry all the time. If anything it is counter-productive.  Good thing is this is all fixable. He has some of the best brains in the game. Rahane, Ashwin, Pujara, Bhuvi are all very smart, intelligent cricketers. Rahul is future. Include all of these guys in the process of decision making as and when needed. If he keeps resting them on a regular basis their role will be limited to save their own places rather than collectively contributing to the team at all level.

 

Drop Bhuvi for Ishant

Drop Rahane for Rohit

Drop Rahul for Dhawan

Drop Umesh/Shami for Bhumrah

Drop Saha for your ego.

Drop Kuldeep for Kumble

 

You call that unquestionable commitment?

Edited January 23, 2018 by mishra

[Shunya]

Kohli by the virtue of dropping everyone from the team has no competition for captainship since nobody is permanent except himself.  Also, with his antics and attitude, it will be impossible for him to play under another captain - Junior or contemporary. 

Its one of the worst situation to be in. Lets just hope other players can bear the arrogance of the captain and still continue to perform.