India has a top order problem

[jusarrived]

1 hour ago, Lannister said:

Apart from England, it's hard to guess. 

India will definitely make semis , most of the sides are weak and won’t take much to beat them . The question though is who will handle the pressure in KOs , as good as Eng is they are poor in that regard historically.

i think even Pakistan will fancy their chances , they are the most improved side in recent times 

[Lannister]

4 hours ago, jusarrived said:

India will definitely make semis , most of the sides are weak and won’t take much to beat them . The question though is who will handle the pressure in KOs , as good as Eng is they are poor in that regard historically.

i think even Pakistan will fancy their chances , they are the most improved side in recent times 

SL beat India in the last champions trophy and the core of our team still remains the same. On the other side, teams like NZ, WI have massively improved and throw in Australia, Pak and SL to the mix. It's anyone's game. 

[AuxiliA]

58 minutes ago, Lannister said:

SL beat India in the last champions trophy and the core of our team still remains the same. On the other side, teams like NZ, WI have massively improved and throw in Australia, Pak and SL to the mix. It's anyone's game. 

 

India lost that game because of their toothless bowling. And our bowling has improved by leaps and bounds since then. 

 

Bumrah, Shami, Kuldeep and Chahal are all wicket takers. Don't see anyone, including England chasing 320+ against them. The question is, can our batsmen score that much?

[zen]

Good to see ppl starting to discuss the openers (the subject is catching on) .... Apart from Kohli, we lack desired solidity. Other hope is if Dhawan can replicate his amazing record in ICC/World events. Pandya if in good hitting form will be a match winner 

 

For others, I hope we get more meaningful performances apart from against the likes of SL, BD and Pak

Edited March 3, 2019 by zen

[jusarrived]

2 hours ago, AuxiliA said:

 

India lost that game because of their toothless bowling. And our bowling has improved by leaps and bounds since then. 

 

Bumrah, Shami, Kuldeep and Chahal are all wicket takers. Don't see anyone, including England chasing 320+ against them. The question is, can our batsmen score that much?

India lost that game cos we only posted a par total at best on a flat bed . We where wicket less in the first 25 overs scoring at less than 5.5 rpo 

[Ankit_sharma03]

4 hours ago, Lannister said:

SL beat India in the last champions trophy and the core of our team still remains the same. On the other side, teams like NZ, WI have massively improved and throw in Australia, Pak and SL to the mix. It's anyone's game. 

we have kuldeep n chahal now n they have made a massive diff 

We dont have yuvraj singh- who was a huge minus in field n running btw wkts , rayudu has become a bad fielder still wnt be that bad 

backups look good now unless our selectors go for blunder options

 

We are definitely making semis 

Edited March 3, 2019 by Ankit_sharma03

[Austin 3:!6]

Kohli's form is also a worry along with Dhawan. Rohit is finished in my view and wont be that effective anymore, so its not just form with him. Then we have has been uncles in middle order.

We should have prepared Prithvi Shaw and Shubhman Gill for the world cup but our selectors screwed it up. This is the 1st time we are relying on bowling in an ICC tournament.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[AuxiliA]

8 hours ago, jusarrived said:

India lost that game cos we only posted a par total at best on a flat bed . We where wicket less in the first 25 overs scoring at less than 5.5 rpo 

 

Yeah our openers could have scored more quickly. But there is absolutely no excuse not defending 321 against an inexperienced lineup, especially after having them at 11-1 after 5 overs.

 

I remember that match quite well and no one thought SL had a chance in the chase.

 

[flamy]

22 hours ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

Kohli's form is also a worry along with Dhawan. Rohit is finished in my view and wont be that effective anymore, so its not just form with him. Then we have has been uncles in middle order.

We should have prepared Prithvi Shaw and Shubhman Gill for the world cup but our selectors screwed it up. This is the 1st time we are relying on bowling in an ICC tournament.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
 

1983, 1985, 2011 -- all won because of bowling, I'd say

[Lannister]

On 3/3/2019 at 10:10 PM, AuxiliA said:

 

India lost that game because of their toothless bowling. And our bowling has improved by leaps and bounds since then. 

 

Bumrah, Shami, Kuldeep and Chahal are all wicket takers. Don't see anyone, including England chasing 320+ against them. The question is, can our batsmen score that much?

No doubt our bowling has become strong but at the same time, the batting has regressed and the back up options are not match ready. During Knockout stages, it's easier to expose this lot. 

[vvvslaxman]

Coming back to the topic, let us say India loses their top three before they get to 50, you think our middle order will still be able to go at a decent pace in the middle and finish it well? I mean someone will get a century in the middle order?  In the last couple of years Indian middle and lower order have a grand total of 1 century. In the same period Indian top 3 has scored 30 centuries. 

 

30 vs 1

 

Since we would like to be "England" let us compare their top vs middle

 

18 vs 8

 

Basically their top order , middle order all can score centuries. Our middle order cannot score big if top 3 go missing. 

 

Add to that England lower order (8 to 11) have made 4 fifties during the same period. 

 

In terms of fire power we are simply inadequate. So Indian batting approach will be different from other teams. 

[flamy]

Indian batting approach can be different, no issues there. But, they are not even doing what they used to do, the openers. Need to give Rahul a game ASAP

 

Shankar looked really good for a big score today but for the unlucky run out.

[jalebi_bhai]

Rohit needs to lose weight. Dhawan needs a kick up his arse. Wouldn't be the worst idea to give Rahul a go in the next game. He's in good form atm.

[vvvslaxman]

I can still show the thread where people wanted our top order to fail so that middle order get exposed as much as possible. We got our wish. This is truly a blessing in disguise. Don't want these to walk out in every goddamn match and score 100 or 50 in each innings.  I fully expect them to do well in the world cup. Rightnow this is an unsettled middle order. They need to get the combination right and they have to be in sync with each other. Rayudu is the only disturbing element in this line up. Rest are all set except some condition based selection

 

Chahal vs Jadeja

Bhuvi vs Shami

 

These are the only two conundrums we have.  Chahal is an easy choice over Jaddu. Bhuvi vs Shami , in terms of form Shami should get the nod.  

[flamy]

Both the openers need to show some application.

 

Chahal vs Jadeja, Jadeja easily with Pandya not in the 11. Otherwise, Chahal. Bhuvi vs Shami, no question at all with Shami all the way.

[zen]

Bilaterals give players the opportunity to get 1 or 2 good performances playing vs the same team .... I won't be surprised if openers click in 1 of the remaining 3 games after 2 failures to make TM persist with them .... That level of consistency would mean Ind starting on the wrong foot in WC, where you play all other teams once in group stages

 

 

Edited March 5, 2019 by zen

[coffee_rules]

I seriously doubt abilities of our MO/Lower MO in this team, we don't havr good finishers and Dhoni is a HUGE liability. Jadhav will be exploited outside India. Rayudu too. And we trusted them for 2019!

[flamy]

1 hour ago, coffee_rules said:

I seriously doubt abilities of our MO/Lower MO in this team, we don't havr good finishers and Dhoni is a HUGE liability. Jadhav will be exploited outside India. Rayudu too. And we trusted them for 2019!

That was a known issue, and they have actually helped us win the last few matches that we have won.

 

Our much-vaunted, best openers have failed consistently. No team can consistently recover, or score big if you are constantly 2 down below 40. That's not how cricket works.

[putrevus]

If India has top order issues then every team in  cricket has top order issues. 

[cowboysfan]

its mainly  a Dhawan problem. his batting against  spinners is shocking, teams are introducing  off spinners early  to get him out.