Washington Sundar - 13 overs, no wicket. Next 61 balls, 7 wickets - question for experts

[BacktoCricaddict]

Those who understand game-nuances and watched the NZ innings, can you comment on what was different about WS' bowling (or other factors like field setting, pitch conditions ...) that made the difference for him?

[sensible-indian]

I would love to hear the analysis too.

 

He was sooo good towards the end.

 

Was bowling thunderbolts.

[Need4Speed]

I am not an expert..but I think..the shine of the ball was gone..and that may affect the drift..dip..and other aspects..a bit..which assisted him more..

Edited October 24, 2024 by Need4Speed

[Lord]

Rachin's wicket. None of the other bats are good v spin. Even in Bangalore they fell quickly before Southee joined Rachin.

[raki05]

He presented perfect example of intraday trader!!

[vvvslaxman]

I watched it. It was pure brilliance. One important thing is trajectory which nobody was comfortable with. It comes at you at an awkward angle. So many mosjudgement from every single player. He should have hade 2 or 3 wickets in the first phase as well.  Rachin was almost plumb. Umpires call saved him. He missed the stumps few mms quiet a few times. He hit the same spot time and again. Even though clock speed of Ash and wash were similar, washing was quicker off the pitch due to the way he released. To be frank I have seen Washi only as a defensive bowler. First time I saw him as an attacking bowler. Not a single wicket was fluke wicket. In short he has vastly improved.  Will he sustain. We have to wait and see.

[singhvivek141]

Pitch had turn, infact much turn.
That helps sometimes the accurate bowlers who dont turn much....the deviation is just enough to miss the edge.
Jaddu and Ashwin were getting great amount of turn, but it was so much that it kept on missing bat, stumps everything.

Kinda reminded me of spell of Steve O'Keefe in 2017 on the same ground, he was causing havoc with his slight movements. While jaddu and Ash were getting massive turn in comparison.
https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/ind-v-aus-2016-17-1030197/india-vs-australia-1st-test-1062573/full-scorecard

Edited October 24, 2024 by singhvivek141

[saransh]

The dip he got and sharp turn. Just watch Rachin's wicket. Rachin couldn't get to the pitch of the ball due to the dip but he thought he covered the angle and just at the last moment it turned away, beautiful delivery 

[Lone Wolf]

@Nikhil_cric @Gollum

From Cricinfo... It suggests Sundar worked on his run up and managed to find overspin with bounce.

 

Sriram suggested a few technical tweaks.

 

"So one thing we spoke about was his run-up speed, you know, just get more energy into his run-up rather than just ambling, and more of overspin," Sriram, who was following Washington's spell from Chennai, told ESPNcricinfo. "He had a little bit of a finger issue also recently, so he was recovering from that. So one of the things we spoke about is always going back to that overspin, which gives him more bounce. And overspin is possible only when you have that momentum in the run-up.

 

"If you don't have momentum in the run-up, it's very difficult to get that overspin. One of the things we discussed was obviously bounce was his main weapon. And how he can use that to his advantage in both white ball and red-ball cricket."

[neel roy]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

I watched it. It was pure brilliance. One important thing is trajectory which nobody was comfortable with. It comes at you at an awkward angle. So many mosjudgement from every single player. He should have hade 2 or 3 wickets in the first phase as well.  Rachin was almost plumb. Umpires call saved him. He missed the stumps few mms quiet a few times. He hit the same spot time and again. Even though clock speed of Ash and wash were similar, washing was quicker off the pitch due to the way he released. To be frank I have seen Washi only as a defensive bowler. First time I saw him as an attacking bowler. Not a single wicket was fluke wicket. In short he has vastly improved.  Will he sustain. We have to wait and see.

Umpire Illingworth is very anti indian. Datyll mitchell was plumb. He didnt give him out. Thank god we reviewed. He is the same bloody umpire who gave Olly Robinson not out in that famous Lords test second innings when Bumrah bowled perhaps one of his best balls. His face showed bewilderment when it showed 3 reds. Same * face expression was there today too. 

[neel roy]

6 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said:

@Nikhil_cric @Gollum

From Cricinfo... It suggests Sundar worked on his run up and managed to find overspin with bounce.

 

Sriram suggested a few technical tweaks.

 

"So one thing we spoke about was his run-up speed, you know, just get more energy into his run-up rather than just ambling, and more of overspin," Sriram, who was following Washington's spell from Chennai, told ESPNcricinfo. "He had a little bit of a finger issue also recently, so he was recovering from that. So one of the things we spoke about is always going back to that overspin, which gives him more bounce. And overspin is possible only when you have that momentum in the run-up.

 

"If you don't have momentum in the run-up, it's very difficult to get that overspin. One of the things we discussed was obviously bounce was his main weapon. And how he can use that to his advantage in both white ball and red-ball cricket."

The way he got Steve Smith out in Brisbane to me he would have still been a legend if he didnt play a single test. Smith had scored a 140 in previous test in sydney and was coming back to form. Sundar will be kind of a lyon kind of bowler with overspin than side spin like ashwin. He ll be dangerous in mumbai but in flat tracks of rajkot he wont be successful. 

[Nikhil_cric]

@neel roy @Gollum @Lord @Lone Wolf

 

Overspin is key on flat LOI pitches as well

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/deception-by-dip-the-t20-spinner-s-invisible-weapon-1451215

 

I never rated Varun C as a spinner after I saw him in 2021. 

 

But apparently, he has worked on his bowling and his recent success was because he was hitting that 5-6 m length hard with overspin .

 

Even today , Washi was extremely accurate and bowling with a lot of overspin. 

 

These are very good signs . 

 

Only fast bowlers seem to be in developmental hell with stagnation, injuries and decline plaguing that department. 

 

Something radical has to change there. 

 

 

 

 

[vvvslaxman]

30 minutes ago, Nikhil_cric said:

@neel roy @Gollum @Lord @Lone Wolf

 

Overspin is key on flat LOI pitches as well

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/deception-by-dip-the-t20-spinner-s-invisible-weapon-1451215

 

I never rated Varun C as a spinner after I saw him in 2021. 

 

But apparently, he has worked on his bowling and his recent success was because he was hitting that 5-6 m length hard with overspin .

 

Even today , Washi was extremely accurate and bowling with a lot of overspin. 

 

These are very good signs . 

 

Only fast bowlers seem to be in developmental hell with stagnation, injuries and decline plaguing that department. 

 

Something radical has to change there. 

 

 

 

 

 

HIgh release point as well. He has a strong pivot.  ANother guy who i have seen similar to Washi is Vicky Ostwal from under-19.

[Vilander]

Is this the first time since a long long time two tamil guys are playing for India? Wow nice, amazing India, it's like two South Africans playing for England. 

[Frustrated]

1 hour ago, Vilander said:

Is this the first time since a long long time two tamil guys are playing for India? Wow nice, amazing India, it's like two South Africans playing for England. 

M Vijay & Ashwin hv played together a lot till 2018. 

[Frustrated]

I hv watched the entire replay of yesterday's play.  I don't think Sundar's changed approach brought him the wickets in the later half.  It was his consistency of line & length which was the key.   He was targeting that middle & off stump line.  Was a bit unlucky in the initial phase where lots of balls were missing the outside edge by a whisker (particularly Convay looked like he might get out anytime.  But somehow he managed to hang around). 

Edited October 25, 2024 by Frustrated

[Number]

1 hour ago, Vilander said:

 tamil guys are playing for India? it's like two South Africans playing for England. 

What ?? Is it a troll post ?

[Number]

He has always been a very good bowler whenever I watched him. 

In Nidhas 2018 he was MOTS.

Then in BGT in Australia he bowled pretty well.

One whole IPL season he bowled in PP with very decent economy.

In BD ODIs 2022 he was one of our most successful bowlers.

 

Check this match, on one of the flattest tracks how economical he is compared to other spinners.

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/australia-in-india-2023-24-1389381/india-vs-australia-3rd-odi-1389390/full-scorecard

 

Not surprised that he did well.

Injuries and long layoffs have stalled his progress, otherwise he would have been established player in the XI by now.

 

 

[mani sha]

Reasons for wash success - 

 

a- high release point with accuracy and high speed 

b - support from other end ashwin 

c - over spin . Didn’t undercut the ball except when he wanted to get it to go straight 

d - pitch was dry and supports spinners who can extract bounce . Jadeja looked ordinary cos he doesn’t get that kind of bounce . Axar would have gotten as many wickets as wash on this pitch 

e- nz batting . Except rachin , all were average 

 

washington has been a very good bowler since he arrived . V good line and length . No surprise he got wickets as this was the first time he was chosen as a frontline spinner 

[Gollum]

Fans (including ICFers) were harsh on him because of his white ball game. SRH supporters seem to hate him a lot. 

 

This guy is an out and out test specialist. TM trying to make a T20/ODI AR of him is unnecessary, especially if you also factor in his dodgy fitness and freak injury history.