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SK_IH

With overseas series imminent,current batting lineup gives no confidence

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Virat, Pujara and Rahane are the supposed bulkwarks of this batting lineup but none of them gives that belief that they will/can dominate opposition overseas.It was disappointing to see them struggle against someone like Lakmal,average bowler at best.

  • Mostly I am worried about Rahane,this guy cannot have such inconsistent spells like he has had in his career so far.If continues the trend,series winning can be a distant dream.
  • Pujara has a massive question mark against his name,we dont know how different his returns will be this time around.
  • Unlike most here,I am most confident about Virat,he has his shortcomings but i have inkling he will standout and mostly someone we will depend on.
  • In last few series our lower order has been contributing a lot but I have my doubts about their contribution overseas against a competent opposition.Them getting blown away most times is likely.I am including Pandya in the lower order,we dont know about his abilities in testing conditions still.
  • Also we dont know who is the ideal partner for Rahul at the top,having a walking at the top once again will put middle order under pressure.

 

I see  real optimism among some here about India's chances this time but this batting lineup is quite fragile.Please discuss

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This similar line up played pretty decent without Tendulkar-Lacman-Dravid when they went last time around with Kohli and Pujara scoring lot of runs, in 2 match test series.

 

I feel they will do all right. I am concerned about opening but eventually middle order will find its way to score runs including thelower order.

 

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I think the batting is doing okay. Look, when conditions are extremely seamer friendly, even moderate pacers can look very threatening. Lakmal is good at exploiting seaming conditions and did just that. The good thing is that if Bhuvi, Shami stay fit, we have a top class bowling line-up that could exploit these conditions possibly even better than the opposition bowlers.

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8 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Unnecessarily pessimistic thread.  

kind of batting that was on display against a ranji level seam bowling attack is reason enough,rabada and steyn will not give many freebies

i maintain it will be the batting that will difference in upcoming tours

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3 minutes ago, SK_IH said:

kind of batting that was on display against a ranji level seam bowling attack is reason enough,rabada and steyn will not give many freebies

i maintain it will be the batting that will difference in upcoming tours

this kolkata pitch has spongy bounce and damp air conditions. I am not sure if this will be the case in SA pitches, agreed they will have some aid to fast bowlers, but it will be hard pitches with bounce, with slighly more pace than kolkata. batsmen like Rahul/Kohli will like it even Pandya/Ashwin who like playing on the up. The challenge will be Indian bowlers being able to deliver like they do so far.  We can expect some Drawn tests, unless steyn and co have a great game or Indian ones have an exceptionally poor one.

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Just now, Vilander said:

this kolkata pitch has spongy bounce and damp air conditions. I am not sure if this will be the case in SA pitches, agreed they will have some aid to fast bowlers, but it will be hard pitches with bounce, with slighly more pace than kolkata. batsmen like Rahul/Kohli will like it even Pandya/Ashwin who like playing on the up. The challenge will be Indian bowlers being able to deliver like they do so far.  We can expect some Drawn tests, unless steyn and co have a great game or Indian ones have an exceptionally poor one.

batting lineup will have to score par scores for bowlers to do something,failing which i dont see this side winning anything

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6 minutes ago, SK_IH said:

kind of batting that was on display against a ranji level seam bowling attack is reason enough,rabada and steyn will not give many freebies

i maintain it will be the batting that will difference in upcoming tours

Our batting will click if the team selection is right. Rahul has to be in good nick and Vijay needs to channel his 2013-15 spirit. Dhawan shouldn't play and I say this as his fan, Viru was a liability in all our matches in SA bar his debut (and he wasn't an opener there) and Dhawan is an inferior version of Viru. Unless the top 3 (think of Che as our 3rd opener) don't protect Kohli, Rahane from the brand new red cherry we have no chance. We need to be really boring at the top, grind the opponents to dust. Vijay and Che are such crucial elements of that approach, I only wish Vijay leaves the ball as well as he did in his last overseas cycle, that clearly drives bowlers mad.  

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After the last match regardless of how the game ended I am concerned about our bowling...our spinners have always been toothless overseas and give no confidence  and our seam bowlers seem to either look like a million bucks one second and total paupers the next. There is no consistency...usually by the time they figure it out and get into the zone damage might be done.

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2 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Our batting will click if the team selection is right. Rahul has to be in good nick and Vijay needs to channel his 2013-15 spirit. Dhawan shouldn't play and I say this as his fan, Viru was a liability in all our matches in SA bar his debut (and he wasn't an opener there) and Dhawan is an inferior version of Viru. Unless the top 3 (think of Che as our 3rd opener) don't protect Kohli, Rahane from the brand new red cherry we have no chance. We need to be really boring at the top, grind the opponents to dust. Vijay and Che are such crucial elements of that approach, I only wish Vijay leaves the ball as well as he did in his last overseas cycle, that clearly drives bowlers mad.  

Regarding Pujara,he has lots to prove whether he cxan also score big apart from just grinding it on such tracks,playing 200 balls without scoring much will be of no use

dhawan will be opener now,its a given

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10 minutes ago, Laaloo said:

We definitely do need the extra batsman in. Most of the times the 5th bowler doesnt even bowl so go in with an extra batsman.

In 2010-11 our extra batsman was Raina in the 1st test and Che in the next 2. In 2013-14 tour our extra batter was Maggi. In spite of our extra batsmen doing zilch then, our overall totals were decent in those 2 tours. Hard to see Pandya, Ash doing worse than Raina/2010 Che/Maggi. Besides Saha is an upgrade over Dhoni and our tail has some ability this time around. 

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11 hours ago, Vilander said:

this kolkata pitch has spongy bounce and damp air conditions. I am not sure if this will be the case in SA pitches, agreed they will have some aid to fast bowlers, but it will be hard pitches with bounce, with slighly more pace than kolkata. batsmen like Rahul/Kohli will like it even Pandya/Ashwin who like playing on the up. The challenge will be Indian bowlers being able to deliver like they do so far.  We can expect some Drawn tests, unless steyn and co have a great game or Indian ones have an exceptionally poor one.

Kolkata was spongy only in the first innings due to moisture but became quicker with pace and bounce after the sun came out. Some thing will happen in SA. They will be very  much like Eden especially wanderers if it is a green top. They are not pacey and bouncy from day one. they get quicker as the game progresses and moisture dries out. Capetown might have grass but it will be slow throughout. Durban is also not the same it used to be. Only pitch that will offer pace and bounce is Wanderers.

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11 hours ago, Laaloo said:

We definitely do need the extra batsman in. Most of the times the 5th bowler doesnt even bowl so go in with an extra batsman.

no, we do need extra 4th seamer like Pandya who can bat. dont think he will do worse than Rohit as a batsman.

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11 hours ago, Vilander said:

this kolkata pitch has spongy bounce and damp air conditions. I am not sure if this will be the case in SA pitches, agreed they will have some aid to fast bowlers, but it will be hard pitches with bounce, with slighly more pace than kolkata. batsmen like Rahul/Kohli will like it even Pandya/Ashwin who like playing on the up. The challenge will be Indian bowlers being able to deliver like they do so far.  We can expect some Drawn tests, unless steyn and co have a great game or Indian ones have an exceptionally poor one.

This. Happen quite often. 

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4 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

no, we do need extra 4th seamer like Pandya who can bat. dont think he will do worse than Rohit as a batsman.

South Africa is a place to play a specialist player...sure one might think he will not do worse than a specialist batsman like Rohit but the thinking should be that if you play a batsman he will win games with the bat and the same applies to a bowler with the ball.

 

Not about Rohit here but in SA we need a 6+1+4 combo because on a spicy pitch 4 bowlers will do the job but on a flat “South African” pitch we need a stronger batting line up....dare I say Saha has been impressive but I have no faith in him to score tons of runs in South Africa against their bowling.

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13 minutes ago, maniac said:

South Africa is a place to play a specialist player...sure one might think he will not do worse than a specialist batsman like Rohit but the thinking should be that if you play a batsman he will win games with the bat and the same applies to a bowler with the ball.

 

Not about Rohit here but in SA we need a 6+1+4 combo because on a spicy pitch 4 bowlers will do the job but on a flat “South African” pitch we need a stronger batting line up....dare I say Saha has been impressive but I have no faith in him to score tons of runs in South Africa against their bowling.

but we don't have a sixth batsman who can win the game for us. I dont have faith even in rohit to score runs in SA against any bowling. Actually i have more faith in Pandya's batting than Rohit's in test cricket. 

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OP seems unrealistic, presently Indian side is among the best batting lineup, anywhere, yes I would not have Dhawan but Vijay

Rahul

Vijay

Pujara

Kohli

Rahane

Saha

Are you joking, seriously.

This lineup is as good or even better then Big 3, look at their numbers .

 

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37 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Kolkata was spongy only in the first innings due to moisture but became quicker with pace and bounce after the sun came out. Some thing will happen in SA. They will be very  much like Eden especially wanderers if it is a green top. They are not pacey and bouncy from day one. they get quicker as the game progresses and moisture dries out. Capetown might have grass but it will be slow throughout. Durban is also not the same it used to be. Only pitch that will offer pace and bounce is Wanderers.

if it remains cloudy and sun doesnt come out like against eng then batting will be hard at wanderers

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8 minutes ago, MCcricket said:

OP seems unrealistic, presently Indian side is among the best batting lineup, anywhere, yes I would not have Dhawan but Vijay

Rahul

Vijay

Pujara

Kohli

Rahane

Saha

Are you joking, seriously.

This lineup is as good or even better then Big 3, look at their numbers .

 

 i dont see this batting as good as you think it is,and lulz at saha ,this guy plays behind ashwin, i dont have much faith in him,anything that is scored after rahane overseas will be a bonus

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4 minutes ago, SK_IH said:

 i dont see this batting as good as you think it is,and lulz at saha ,this guy plays behind ashwin, i dont have much faith in him,anything that is scored after rahane overseas will be a bonus

Saha is batting below Ashwin so that Ashwin, Jadeja can express themselves n go for their strokes, Saha can bat with the tail, has good temperament, technique, n if you can see that too bad, Saha might be as good then most BATSMEN in teams like Pakistan, SL, he has averaged 45 this year, you might sound delirious if you make a comment like that.

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16 minutes ago, MCcricket said:

Saha is batting below Ashwin so that Ashwin, Jadeja can express themselves n go for their strokes, Saha can bat with the tail, has good temperament, technique, n if you can see that too bad, Saha might be as good then most BATSMEN in teams like Pakistan, SL, he has averaged 45 this year, you might sound delirious if you make a comment like that.

numerous times it seems team management has no trust in his abilities and you are talking about expressing themselves as if ashwin plays like gilchrist, if he had been such type of  player,saha getting the demotion would have made sense but thats not the case

and jadeja is not a batsman whether he expresses himself or not 

 

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13 minutes ago, Temujin Khaghan said:

Kolkata was more akin to English conditions

 

Sa will have more bounce than swing. Ishant will be more useful than bhuvi there.

in an imaginary world ishant has always been our best bowler in sa ,he is tall and gets bounce :rofl: 

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15 minutes ago, Temujin Khaghan said:

Kolkata was more akin to English conditions

 

Sa will have more bounce than swing. Ishant will be more useful than bhuvi there.

my starting XI there will be Shami, BK, Ishant.

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3 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

who do you want Umesh? At least Ishant wont leak runs like charity.

Ishant averages like a batsman in South Africa. He has a mighty 54 avg and 3.5 economy. I would never selected someone with such figures that too a tall bowler who can take advantage of pitches in southafrica.

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The thing with our 3rd bowler they are mostly inconsistent be it Ishant or umesh. Decision on umesh should be after the srilanka series. He hasn't played that much cricket that's only the benefit of doubt for him. He was bowling really well against Australia wonder what happened to him.

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17 minutes ago, gattaca said:

Ishant averages like a batsman in South Africa. He has a mighty 54 avg and 3.5 economy. I would never selected someone with such figures that too a tall bowler who can take advantage of pitches in southafrica.

select someone else then. 

Edited by rkt.india

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14 minutes ago, gattaca said:

The thing with our 3rd bowler they are mostly inconsistent be it Ishant or umesh. Decision on umesh should be after the srilanka series. He hasn't played that much cricket that's only the benefit of doubt for him. He was bowling really well against Australia wonder what happened to him.

he id play ranji trophy. he did play some.

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23 minutes ago, gattaca said:

Ishant averages like a batsman in South Africa. He has a mighty 54 avg and 3.5 economy. I would never selected someone with such figures that too a tall bowler who can take advantage of pitches in southafrica.

:hysterical:

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1. Rahul

2. Vijay

3. Pujara 

4. Kohli

5. Rahane

6. Shankar / Pandya

7. Saha

8. Jadeja / Ashwin 

9. Bhuvi 

10. Shami 

11. Bumrah / Ishant

 

Shankar on seaming tracks and Pandya on flat tracks

 

 

Both batting and bowling looks balanced

 

Edited by express bowling

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10 minutes ago, sarchasm said:

If only the selectors had the foresight to include Bumrah for the currest series against SL, they'd have given themselves another option in terms of fast bowling combination in South Africa.

 

Not including Bumrah is appalling.

 

We have a pacer who combines wicket-taking-ability + accuracy + pace + bounce + seaming ability + ability to learn + international cricket experience ..... and he is not in our plans for SA tests   !!!!   

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3 hours ago, SK_IH said:

numerous times it seems team management has no trust in his abilities and you are talking about expressing themselves as if ashwin plays like gilchrist, if he had been such type of  player,saha getting the demotion would have made sense but thats not the case

and jadeja is not a batsman whether he expresses himself or not 

 

You seem to contradict yourself, when mentioned that Saha averages 45 this year you talk about faith in his abilities, Virat n management haven't looked at any keeper in test since Dhoni retired cause they have faith in him, Virat mentioned this several times before, if you can't recognize the abilities n performance of current batters you r not qualified to judge test cricketers then, barring Dhawan, Rohit who hopefully won't be playing our line up is solid.

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On 11/21/2017 at 10:12 AM, SK_IH said:

Virat, Pujara and Rahane are the supposed bulkwarks of this batting lineup but none of them gives that belief that they will/can dominate opposition overseas.It was disappointing to see them struggle against someone like Lakmal,average bowler at best.

  • Mostly I am worried about Rahane,this guy cannot have such inconsistent spells like he has had in his career so far.If continues the trend,series winning can be a distant dream.
  • Pujara has a massive question mark against his name,we dont know how different his returns will be this time around.
  • Unlike most here,I am most confident about Virat,he has his shortcomings but i have inkling he will standout and mostly someone we will depend on.
  • In last few series our lower order has been contributing a lot but I have my doubts about their contribution overseas against a competent opposition.Them getting blown away most times is likely.I am including Pandya in the lower order,we dont know about his abilities in testing conditions still.
  • Also we dont know who is the ideal partner for Rahul at the top,having a walking at the top once again will put middle order under pressure.

 

I see  real optimism among some here about India's chances this time but this batting lineup is quite fragile.Please discuss

each and every bit has come true unfortunately

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46 minutes ago, kosingh said:

Are there any great batting lineups in the world today? too many players just don't have the grit needed to bat for long in tests. 

Renshaw showed the gritiness i think, so did Haseeb Hameed. I am only talking about their grit and application , not their performances and success. 

 

I watched once Naseer Hussain scored 143 in 430 balls or so. It was many many eyars back. That was one of the most gritty knock i have watched someone play. Pujara is one gritty batsman, Cook showed lot fo grit.

 

Due to the advent of ODI, T20 and T10, the players are getting diverted to strokeplay. Even Pujara wanted to have his sahre of T20 in IPL, but onyl when he was not bid for, he opted to lay county etc. The money that T20 offers has lot of impact on the choices that some of the worlds best cricketers have made. And they are right, its their profession and thats their sourc eof income. Obviously they will try toswitch formats and adapt to the most lucrative one more. Nothing wrong in that.

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Bowlers did excellent despite being handicapped with Ishant

 

but what a let down from batsmen...out of their depth

 

Granted SA had luck with the won two tosses on two poor quality pitches and got first use of it, but batting seemed lacking intent and determination barring Kohli

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