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Temujin Khaghan

Jinnah did more harm than good for Muslims..

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Read my post and say your opinion, whether you agree or disagree..

...

 

If Hindus really have religious fanaticism, BJP or the earlier janta party would have won every election from independence. But the only 2 elections bjp won are because of anti incumbency vote and not because of religious feeling.

 

If current Muslims of Pakistan and Bangladesh had stayed back in united India, I swear muslim majority parties would have formed central government atleast 3 out of 10 elections. There would have been 35 percent Muslims in India I think and they would have dominated in many industries of India including the economy and definitely Bollywood itself. I find it funny that many Bollywood stars have excess fake love for Pakistan but had the Pakistani Punjabis been players in this industry, many of the current Bollywood stars would have been jobless.

 

Jinnah failed to realize that Hindus are not obsessed with religion, but rather with caste, region and language. Instead of silently hating them from a corner, he should have mingled with Hindus for a bit and he would have realised this truth. Indian Politics survives not on the basis of religion but on basis of caste. 

 

By taking away a major chunk of Muslims from India, Jinnah has made double sure that Hindus dominate in India no matter what. He also destroyed any chance of artistic independance and gender equality in Pakistan by forming a country with the foundation of an medieval religion. How far can a country go if it's very constitution preaches bias towards people of only one religion. 

 

So more than Muslims of pakistan, it is the core Hindus who should be saying #thankyou Jinnah on his birthday or on independence day?

 

 

Edited by Temujin Khaghan
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I thank Jinnah for the partition, we don't realize how lucky we are today. Imagine an India with 35-40% Muslim population and 8-9 Muslim majority provinces !!!!!! My only regret is that the partition could have been done over a period of 5 years  so that there could have been more peaceful migration. And more Muslims whose hearts beat for Pak (remember how they voted en masse for Muslim League in 1945) should have been coaxed to leave India, same with Hindus/Sikhs/Christians/Buddhists of the 2 Pakistans. 'Hindus and Muslims can't coexist' said Jinnah, what wrong did he say? IMO he was more intelligent than our founding fathers in understanding the historical baggage of the subcontinent.

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Agreed with your post.

The guy represented the landed Muslim elite of UP who were wary of living under a Congress dominated Govt which had land reforms high on its agenda as evinced by Nehru report.

They knew they would lost the eminent position enjoyed during the British Raj who propped up the reactionary elements within this aforementioned group to keep a check on the growing power of congess which was seen as a secular party.

The proof of this can be seen in the present day Pakistan where feudalism is still alive and thriving as we speak.

 

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5 hours ago, Temujin Khaghan said:

Read my post and say your opinion, whether you agree or disagree..

...

 

If Hindus really have religious fanaticism, BJP or the earlier janta party would have won every election from independence. But the only 2 elections bjp won are because of anti incumbency vote and not because of religious feeling.

 

If current Muslims of Pakistan and Bangladesh had stayed back in united India, I swear muslim majority parties would have formed central government atleast 3 out of 10 elections. There would have been 35 percent Muslims in India I think and they would have dominated in many industries of India including the economy and definitely Bollywood itself. I find it funny that many Bollywood stars have excess fake love for Pakistan but had the Pakistani Punjabis been players in this industry, many of the current Bollywood stars would have been jobless.

 

Jinnah failed to realize that Hindus are not obsessed with religion, but rather with caste, region and language. Instead of silently hating them from a corner, he should have mingled with Hindus for a bit and he would have realised this truth. Indian Politics survives not on the basis of religion but on basis of caste. 

 

By taking away a major chunk of Muslims from India, Jinnah has made double sure that Hindus dominate in India no matter what. He also destroyed any chance of artistic independance and gender equality in Pakistan by forming a country with the foundation of an medieval religion. How far can a country go if it's very constitution preaches bias towards people of only one religion. 

 

So more than Muslims of pakistan, it is the core Hindus who should be saying #thankyou Jinnah on his birthday or on independence day?

 

 

Did not you guys have Hindu rate of growth for much of your history and Pakistan was ahead economically not that it is good benchmark?

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5 hours ago, Gollum said:

I thank Jinnah for the partition, we don't realize how lucky we are today. Imagine an India with 35-40% Muslim population and 8-9 Muslim majority provinces !!!!!! My only regret is that the partition could have been done over a period of 5 years  so that there could have been more peaceful migration. And more Muslims whose hearts beat for Pak (remember how they voted en masse for Muslim League in 1945) should have been coaxed to leave India, same with Hindus/Sikhs/Christians/Buddhists of the 2 Pakistans. 'Hindus and Muslims can't coexist' said Jinnah, what wrong did he say? IMO he was more intelligent than our founding fathers in understanding the historical baggage of the subcontinent.

Migration continued until 1965 war.

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21 minutes ago, Pakistan said:

Did not you guys have Hindu rate of growth for much of your history and Pakistan was ahead economically not that it is good benchmark?

West Pakistan is Naturally blessed region.It has very fertile land and population was not crammped as India or BD.Moreover India allied with Soviet while Pakistan Allied With USA and most of American allies Had much better Growth than Soviet Allies.

 

Also please tell me How much East Pakistan was economically developed When they got Azaadi?

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8 hours ago, Temujin Khaghan said:

If Hindus really have religious fanaticism, BJP or the earlier janta party would have won every election from independence. But the only 2 elections bjp won are because of anti incumbency vote and not because of religious feeling.

It may be, in case of united India, the BJP type party would have come to power very earlier due to the fear of Islamic fanaticism. This was the fear behind the creation of Pakistan (as has been taught in Pakistan)

 

With the tendencies which I see among the Muslim population, and now also in the Hindu population, then for sure it would have brought a bloody collision and bloody Civil War in the united India sooner or later. 

 

Therefore, creation of Pakistan was good for the Hindus and other minorities of India and also for the Secularists of India. While it made life miserable for the minorities and the Secularists in Pakistan (and even the life of the sects like Shias and Barailvis also became miserable in Pakistan). 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Singh bling said:

West Pakistan is Naturally blessed region.It has very fertile land and population was not crammped as India or BD.Moreover India allied with Soviet while Pakistan Allied With USA and most of American allies Had much better Growth than Soviet Allies.

 

Also please tell me How much East Pakistan was economically developed When they got Azaadi?

Err, united Pakistan's economy was 55-45% in Bangladesh's favor till 1971. This is because Bengal region ( Ganges-Brahmaputra delta) is the most fertile soil in the subcontinent. Punjab has caught up quite a lot due to irrigation and better farming practices, but from time we have recorded history, Bengal has been far more productive than Sindh + Punjab put together. This is seen from Mughal era definitively, where Bengal was the richest province in terms of tax revenue. 

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1 hour ago, panther said:

Harm for muslims of India not for those of what makes Pakistan now.

Extremism has no limits. 

 

First extremists fight with people of other religions. And then with the sects with in their religion. And then even within the sects. 

 

Reality is,  many times more Muslims have been killed in Pakistan, than in India. Therefore, Muslims in Pakistan are also not in peace. After minorities, the Ahmadies and Shias were targeted. Then Barailvis and Sufis were targeted. Then Taliban started war against State of Pakistan for imposition of Sharia. Then there was a war between different sections and groups of Taliban. Then ISIS came and they declared Taliban too to be Kafirs and killing Taliban left and right. 

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1 hour ago, Alam_dar said:

Extremism has no limits. 

 

First extremists fight with people of other religions. And then with the sects with in their religion. And then even within the sects. 

 

Reality is,  many times more Muslims have been killed in Pakistan, than in India. Therefore, Muslims in Pakistan are also not in peace. After minorities, the Ahmadies and Shias were targeted. Then Barailvis and Sufis were targeted. Then Taliban started war against State of Pakistan for imposition of Sharia. Then there was a war between different sections and groups of Taliban. Then ISIS came and they declared Taliban too to be Kafirs and killing Taliban left and right. 

It's ok our fertility rate more than makes Up for those killed.

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22 minutes ago, panther said:

It's ok our fertility rate more than makes Up for those killed.

And this is why your people will never, in a million years, be as advanced as the developed countries. Because to your mentality, people's lives are a numbers game. When you start valuing life as important, only then can your people start getting out of the stone age and live like civilized people. 

 

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I thank Jinnah for partition. I'm glad that when I visit Punjab I see signs written in Gurmukhi Punjabi and not that Arabic script which was there before.

 

Although it's a shame that this has crept in slightly due to muslims migrating from UP and Bihar. 

 

There was too much weakness shown by Hindus that allowed such a high number of Muslims to remain after 1947.

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11 hours ago, Alam_dar said:

Extremism has no limits. 

 

First extremists fight with people of other religions. And then with the sects with in their religion. And then even within the sects. 

 

Reality is,  many times more Muslims have been killed in Pakistan, than in India. Therefore, Muslims in Pakistan are also not in peace. After minorities, the Ahmadies and Shias were targeted. Then Barailvis and Sufis were targeted. Then Taliban started war against State of Pakistan for imposition of Sharia. Then there was a war between different sections and groups of Taliban. Then ISIS came and they declared Taliban too to be Kafirs and killing Taliban left and right. 

Isn't that part of progress ,whether it be in a theocracy or liberal democracy.People like heston marched for civil rights but by today's standards liberals would hate him .

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19 hours ago, Pakistan said:

Did not you guys have Hindu rate of growth for much of your history and Pakistan was ahead economically not that it is good benchmark?

Rate of growth had nothing "hindu" about it.  It was about policy choices made by a government which was following the trend - and socialist 'command planning' for economies was in fashion back then.   Its always easy to criticize in hindsight, and people underestimate how difficult it is to properly administer a country of the sheer size and population of India, given the lack of resources - financial and administrative.  

 

Pakistan by contrast had a head start economically because of many factors mentioned above already.   And in a lot of ways, Pakistan can still leapfrog India if it starts getting its act together.  But given the fact that the military mafia boot is firmly on its neck, it aint happening.  

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14 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

Err, united Pakistan's economy was 55-45% in Bangladesh's favor till 1971. This is because Bengal region ( Ganges-Brahmaputra delta) is the most fertile soil in the subcontinent. Punjab has caught up quite a lot due to irrigation and better farming practices, but from time we have recorded history, Bengal has been far more productive than Sindh + Punjab put together. This is seen from Mughal era definitively, where Bengal was the richest province in terms of tax revenue. 

The disparity ratio per capita GDP of West Pakistan to East Pakistan  was 1.6 in 1971.Its population was 45% So West Pakistan Economy was bigger than East Pakistan

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23 hours ago, Pakistan said:

Did not you guys have Hindu rate of growth for much of your history and Pakistan was ahead economically not that it is good benchmark?

Its got nothing to do with Hinduism, it is related to socialist economic policies.

 

"The term ‘Hindu rate of growth’ was coined by Professor Rajkrishna, an Indian economist, in 1978 to characterize the slow growth and to explain it against the backdrop of socialistic economic policies... 
The word “Hindu” in the term was used by some early economists to imply that the Hindu outlook of fatalism and contentedness was responsible for the slow growth. However many later economists pointed out that the so-called Hindu rate of growth was a result of socialist policies implemented by the by the then staunch secular governments and had nothing to do with Hinduism.... "

........ currentaffairs.gktoday.in/fact-box-hindu-rate-growth-0620137062.html © GKToday

 

 

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22 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

Err, united Pakistan's economy was 55-45% in Bangladesh's favor till 1971.

what's the source for the 55-45% economy distribution?

 

22 hours ago, Muloghonto said:

This is because Bengal region ( Ganges-Brahmaputra delta) is the most fertile soil in the subcontinent. Punjab has caught up quite a lot due to irrigation and better farming practices, but from time we have recorded history, Bengal has been far more productive than Sindh + Punjab put together. This is seen from Mughal era definitively, where Bengal was the richest province in terms of tax revenue.

There's a reason Punjab was called the Bread basket of India.

 

a little old quote but drives across the message

"With just 1.5 per cent of India's land area, Punjab produces 20 per cent of the country's wheat and 12 per cent of its rice. It provides 60 per cent of the Central government's reserve stocks of wheat and 40 per cent of its reserves of rice, the country's buffer against starvation. Punjab's amazing productivity made it possible for India to feed most of its growing population that tripled from 350 million when the country became independent in 1947 to more than 1.2 billion people today."
- Mira Kamdar

 

Infact, it is Bengal that has caught up since the 1980's wrt to agriculture.  Bengal was still dependent on the central government to meet its food demands as it missed the green revolution.  Punjab, on the other hand, was at the heart of the green revolution has been feeding the nation.

 

Even in its current form today, Punjab is richer than Bengal and outperforms in various indicators

 

"Among major states, people in Delhi and Punjab are the richest with more than 60% of their households in the top wealth quintile "

source

 

Even for GSDP per capita income, Punjab is way higher than Bengal.

 

Btw, where's that list of Bengali Nobel prize winners you keep flaunting in other threads? Still waiting on that for you to enlighten us

 

 

 

Edited by PBN
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