Wrist spin was bought as an attacking option then why have we moved back to defensive finger spinner option again

[Ankit_sharma03]

The move to bring Kulcha which was hailed so highly as seen as game changer which even proved so. World was using wrist spinner and we were falling behind but we also came to terms with it. The reason we moved from fingers spinner like ashwin n jadeja coz we needed wkt taking option in middle. They both didnt leak runs and cud bat to. 

 

If their form is an issue there are other options- Rahul chahar, markhande, gopal 

If a bit of batting is needed then all 3 can bat better then yuzi as well 

 

Even for A-teams we play mostly- nadeem, gowtham, axar, Krunal mostly......someone gopal is not even on radar 

 

So what happened...has kohli's balls dropped off .

He is back to safety to have batting till 8 ....which is basically a myth kohli has in his head since jadeja batting at 8 is quite **** . Honestly look at opposition bowling do u really need batting that deep 

Edited December 15, 2019 by Ankit_sharma03

[Vilander]

1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

The move to bring Kulcha which was hailed so highly as seen as game changer which even proved so. World was using wrist spinner and we were falling behind but we also came to terms with it. The reason we moved from fingers spinner like ashwin n jadeja coz we needed wkt taking option in middle. They both didnt leak runs and cud bat to. 

 

If their form is an issue there are other options- Rahul chahar, markhande, gopal 

If a bit of batting is needed then all 3 can bat better then yuzi as well 

 

Even for A-teams we play mostly- nadeem, gowtham, axar, Krunal mostly......someone gopal is not even on radar 

 

So what happened...has kohli's balls dropped off .

He is back to safety to have batting till 8 ....which is basically a myth kohli has in his head since jadeja batting at 8 is quite **** . Honestly look at opposition bowling do u really need batting that deep 

they did not believe in it in the first place that's why. This india team is all about being as accurate and predictable as possible so overall they will win the maximum percentage of games but will often be beaten by spirited performances from opposition at crucial points as they will do mathematically the most effective actions. 

[Vk1]

37 minutes ago, Vilander said:

they did not believe in it in the first place that's why. This india team is all about being as accurate and predictable as possible so overall they will win the maximum percentage of games but will often be beaten by spirited performances from opposition at crucial points as they will do mathematically the most effective actions. 

Yeah..there's no room for innovation

[Prabhdeep Singh]

The move of having wrist spinners is the correct option however different wrist spinners need to be tried. Kulcha have been figured out to some extent.

 

It is worth trying S Gopal, Rahul Chahar or Mayank Markande.

 

 

[ShoonyaSifar]

Because we are being led by a bunch of self-serving egoists who have got absolutely no vision and no plans for the future. All that they care about is short term results or filling the team with yes men. 

 

Good that this young WI team has burst their bubble. Public will gradually see through their evil designs despite their PR mafia trying to blame younger players and not these jokers.

[nevada]

7 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

The move to bring Kulcha which was hailed so highly as seen as game changer which even proved so. World was using wrist spinner and we were falling behind but we also came to terms with it. The reason we moved from fingers spinner like ashwin n jadeja coz we needed wkt taking option in middle. They both didnt leak runs and cud bat to. 

 

If their form is an issue there are other options- Rahul chahar, markhande, gopal 

If a bit of batting is needed then all 3 can bat better then yuzi as well 

 

Even for A-teams we play mostly- nadeem, gowtham, axar, Krunal mostly......someone gopal is not even on radar 

 

So what happened...has kohli's balls dropped off .

He is back to safety to have batting till 8 ....which is basically a myth kohli has in his head since jadeja batting at 8 is quite **** . Honestly look at opposition bowling do u really need batting that deep 

+1. Rotate the bowlers and always pursue an aggressive, wicket seeking strategy. There is no point in using finger spinners just because they can also bat a bit.

[Stan AF]

This topic could be extended a bit and I said this in the match thread as well.

 

Our next problem after finding middle order batsmen is to find & groom new bowlers who can take wickets in the middle overs. We have to start looking for wicket taking bowlers outside of (Kul/Cha/Bumrah & Shami). So far I see none.

[Dada's Army]

Not only have India abandoned the Wrist-Spinners-Are-Our-Matchwinners tactic, they have thwarted the attacking nature of our wrist spinners. Yesterday, they didn't have a slip for Kuldeep for the majority of his spell despite him looking most likely to get a wicket. A year ago there would have been a slip, a leg slip or a short leg.

 

But I bet Kohli, by his (ill)logic, will say that they haven't ditched the tactic, they are just 'experimenting' with other tactics and other players. They will continue to 'experiment' ( AKA chop and change) the team up until the last day before the world cup. And we will again go into the next world without knowing what the best 11 and best tactics are. Chewtiya bana rakha hai.

Edited December 16, 2019 by Dada's Army

[raki05]

26 minutes ago, Dada's Army said:

Not only have India abandoned the Wrist-Spinners-Are-Our-Matchwinners tactic, they have thwarted the attacking nature of our wrist spinners. Yesterday, they didn't have a slip for Kuldeep for the majority of his spell despite him looking most likely to get a wicket. A year ago there would have been a slip, a leg slip or a short leg.

 

But I bet Kohli, by his (ill)logic, will say that they haven't ditched the tactic, they are just 'experimenting' with other tactics and other players. They will continue to 'experiment' ( AKA chop and change) the team up until the last day before the world cup. And we will again go into the next world without knowing what the best 11 and best tactics are. Chewtiya bana rakha hai.

This....basically this is the same bullshit TM is blabbering since 17 CT.

[Stan AF]

Process. Podalanga process.

[mani sha]

This team has zero flair 

 

at top they have hit and miss sharma . Aging dhawan - shaw and Agarwal need a chance now 

 

middle order - I have zero clue who is there beyond kohli - and kohli does not allow others to be groomed - or selects dk and jadhav . Praying for pant and Ayer to get stabilized 

 

lower middle order 

pandya has helped 

but shankar / dube / jadeja / dunno who is good 

 

spinners - wrist spin , spin allrounder - kohli has no clue what to do . Has no plan b . Ashwin has been ostracized , no new faces tried . 
 

Fast bowlers 

 

undecutter Zaleel thakur .. trundlers galore . Saini who ? Siraj who ? 
 

it’s a confused team led by a butter finger captain - kohli needs to thank god to have pujara peak ishant Shami sharma bumrah and jadeja in Tests- he doesn’t have Yuvraj in odi and a Yuvraj under him will stop aiming for 6 sixes as after the second six he will try for a single 

[express bowling]

TM has become very defensive in almost all aspects.

 

1. Almost all pacers they are trying these days in LOIs are either medium pacers or mediocre pacers or both.

 

2. They rested Shami, in red hot wicket taking form, in the WC SF.

 

3. Haven't tried any young fast bowlers in test matches, even against weak teams. Saini and Siraj are yet to debut in tests.

 

4. Now they are breaking up the supremely wicket taking wrist spin duo in LOIs ... because they want a bit of batting power at 8 and 9 in T20s. 

 

5. The LOI middle order have suffered a lot due defensive options chosen.

Edited December 16, 2019 by express bowling

[Ankit_sharma03]

17 minutes ago, express bowling said:

TM has become very defensive in almost all aspects.

 

1. Almost all pacers they are trying these days in LOIs are either medium pacers or mediocre pacers or both.

 

2. They rested Shami, in red hot wicket taking form, in the WC SF.

 

3. Haven't tried any young fast bowler in test matches, even against weak teams. Saini and Siraj are yet to debut in tests.

 

4. Now they are breaking up the supremely wicket taking wrist spin duo in LOIs ... because they want a bit of batting power at 8 and 9 in T20s. 

 

5. The LOI middle order have suffered a lot due defensive options chosen.

Also they arent even looking ahead

I doubt that Dhawan, jadhav, Shami wud last till 2023 Wc. They didnt trust jadhav in Wc this year then why is he playing now .....makes no sense at all 

[velu]

2 hours ago, express bowling said:

4. Now they are breaking up the supremely wicket taking wrist spin duo in LOIs ... because they want a bit of batting power at 8 and 9 in T20s. 

 

 

 

[express bowling]

2 hours ago, velu said:

 

 

 

What if Chahal plays and Kuldeep is dropped ?  

 

[velu]

3 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

What if Chahal plays and Kuldeep is dropped ?  

 

me ok with Kuldeep ..

dont say that spinners hunt in pairs

[express bowling]

23 minutes ago, velu said:

me ok with Kuldeep ..

 

I know.  Which is why I pointed out the opposite scenario.  

 

Quote

dont say that spinners hunt in pairs

 

Finger spinners won't hunt at all.  

Edited December 16, 2019 by express bowling

[maniac]

15 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

I know.  Which is why I pointed out the opposite scenario.  

 

 

Finger spinners won't hunt at all.  

It depends on the quality though. An Ashwin from 2011-2016 was a very good bowler. Not going to Murali,Saqlian  or Bhajji because they were mostly successful with the older rules.

 

Shakib is/ was a very good bowler

 

Rashid is not a conventional wrist spinner he uses his fingers a lot but again Nabi is an excellent bowler.

 

Moeen and Lyon are fine in patches in LOIs 

 

Leg spinners are an attacking option and a finger spinner brings control that was the age old theory and it still holds true. Chahal and Kuldeep can pick wickets in a bunch or get smashed on a bad day.

 

I still think India needs the kulcha combo, however I would take Ashwin pre 2016 or someone like him who can also bat a bit in a heart beat in the current squad. Unfortunately no one is available

 

 

Edited December 17, 2019 by maniac