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Stradlater

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vvvslaxman Grand Master

vvvslaxman

Posted
Posted
23 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

 

We should've at least applied this paradigm to DJT:

 

Even a Broken Clock is Right Twice a Day: Shauf, Robert: 9780992037727: Amazon.com: Books

 

 

 

A man who was responsible for millions of infections, hundreds of death through reckless handling of the pandemic for 9 months deserve "some credit" for spreading 40% of conspiracy theories about COVID in the USA?  Many countries that were proximity to China handled the COVID far better. USA had intel (compared to 100s of other countries), they had time on their hand to prepare themselves. He was spewing all sort of nonsense for the best part of his presidency during COVID. He personally infected the entire white house. God knows how many got infected in his MAGA rallies.  Also hired a radiologist to spread false information about COVID. 

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coffee_rules Grand Master

coffee_rules

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8 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

 

How can you gaslight a gaslighter-in-chief lol. His whole presidency was through gaslighting. It eventually came back to bite him.


whatever he is, he won the presidency fair and square. His presidential election was won as per the democratic process. He was a legal president and media and opposition undermined his voice. Now, the new president is saying the same thing. You don’t see the irony,?

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vvvslaxman Grand Master

vvvslaxman

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:


whatever he is, he won the presidency fair and square. His presidential election was won as per the democratic process. He was a legal president and media and opposition undermined his voice. Now, the new president is saying the same thing. You don’t see the irony,?

 

Trump's sayings almost always never had any basis. He just whings it. There is a difference between throwing out conspiracy theories (straight from far right radio )out of nowhere and  saying things after due consideration and fact-checking.  Even now you can see a lot of old men spouting one conspiracy theory or the other.  Besides that his primary job was to see how to arrest the spread right at the beginning not generating conspiracy theories. He initially said COVID is a democratic hoax.  He saidit is like flu. He said it will become 0 in 15 days. There were many reckless statements made by him.   

 

Sure it is import to know the origin to handle future pandemic. That can happen in parallel.  Task at hand now is getting back to normal. It happened inside the borders of China.  How do you think it reached people living 10000 miles away. Even remote island. It could have potentially wreaked havoc in China. Did that happen? Worst damage happened in India/USA/Brazil.  What will happen if have like  spanish flu in 1918 (not from the lab).  Not much travel in that era. Not much population. It still ravaged India.  What about HIV? If Trump were the president in the 80s  he would have said "Africa leaked the virus".  

 

Until Trump nobody dragged scientists and doctors through mud. 

 

 

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rkt.india Grand Master

rkt.india

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On 6/5/2021 at 7:39 PM, vvvslaxman said:

 

Trump's sayings almost always never had any basis. He just whings it. There is a difference between throwing out conspiracy theories (straight from far right radio )out of nowhere and  saying things after due consideration and fact-checking.  Even now you can see a lot of old men spouting one conspiracy theory or the other.  Besides that his primary job was to see how to arrest the spread right at the beginning not generating conspiracy theories. He initially said COVID is a democratic hoax.  He saidit is like flu. He said it will become 0 in 15 days. There were many reckless statements made by him.   

 

Sure it is import to know the origin to handle future pandemic. That can happen in parallel.  Task at hand now is getting back to normal. It happened inside the borders of China.  How do you think it reached people living 10000 miles away. Even remote island. It could have potentially wreaked havoc in China. Did that happen? Worst damage happened in India/USA/Brazil.  What will happen if have like  spanish flu in 1918 (not from the lab).  Not much travel in that era. Not much population. It still ravaged India.  What about HIV? If Trump were the president in the 80s  he would have said "Africa leaked the virus".  

 

Until Trump nobody dragged scientists and doctors through mud. 

 

 

Trump was president, having every intelligence information on his desk. Why would you believe he was saying things out of thin air.

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bharathh Veteran

bharathh

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An IIT team in India published a paper in Jan 2020 talking about the unnatural nature of Covid and it being manufactured due to traits of the virus. They were forced to unpublish their paper ... by folks around the world including Dr. Fauci - the current Man of Medicine in the US. It's always about who says it rather than what is said.

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BacktoCricaddict Grand Master

BacktoCricaddict

Posted
Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, bharathh said:

An IIT team in India published a paper in Jan 2020 talking about the unnatural nature of Covid and it being manufactured due to traits of the virus. They were forced to unpublish their paper ... by folks around the world including Dr. Fauci - the current Man of Medicine in the US. It's always about who says it rather than what is said.

They did not publish it.  They put it out on bioRxiv, a pre-publication portal.  Their analysis was rudimentary, incomplete and fundamentally flawed.  The "amino-acid" sequences that they claimed to be "from HIV" were very short segments found in 100s of proteins from many other organisms, including other viruses. 

 

There are 20 amino acids that constitute proteins.  Typically, proteins are 200 - 2000 amino acids in length, so it is very easy to find a short segment of 4-5 amino acids represented in many proteins across the entire spectrum. I am surprised that they did not take that into consideration and decided to cherry-pick "HIV."  This is the kind of analysis for which I would take 30% points off from my undergraduate students.  

 

As far as "who says it," even Luc Montagnier - famous virologist and Nobel Laureate for his work on HIV - said the same thing and was swiftly corrected. 

Edited by BacktoCricaddict
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bharathh Veteran

bharathh

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Posted
5 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

They did not publish it.  They put it out on bioRxiv, a pre-publication portal.  Their analysis was rudimentary, incomplete and fundamentally flawed.  The "amino-acid" sequences that they claimed to be "from HIV" were very short segments found in 100s of proteins from many other organisms, including other viruses. 

 

There are 20 amino acids that constitute proteins.  Typically, proteins are 200 - 2000 amino acids in length, so it is very easy to find a short segment of 4-5 amino acids represented in many proteins across the entire spectrum. I am surprised that they did not take that into consideration and decided to cherry-pick "HIV."  This is the kind of analysis for which I would take 30% points off from my undergraduate students.  

 

As far as "who says it," even Luc Montagnier - famous virologist and Nobel Laureate for his work on HIV - said the same thing and was swiftly corrected. 

So what has changed now? Why has Fauci done a 180?

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BacktoCricaddict Grand Master

BacktoCricaddict

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Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, bharathh said:

So what has changed now? Why has Fauci done a 180?

First, my post above was about the claim that that the virus was engineered.  That is separate from the claim that says virus leaked from a lab.  So, Fauci debunking the IIT pre-print's "engineered" claim back then, and being open to the lab-leak hypothesis now is not an example of a 180.

 

Second, Fauci never discounted the lab-leak hypothesis. I know you (or anyone else) don't have the time to check out all my posts (and am too lazy to find them now), but I have posted in other threads about this: that the early evidence was pointing towards bat-pangolin origins.  The reason those were pursued vigorously by scientists is because there is precedence for this kind of zoonotic virus jump (SARS 1, MERS etc) - any detective will go with what they think is most likely based on past experiences.  But when those leads were going nowhere, alternative explanations started to get more attention.  Moreover (again, posted here on ICF at some point), Fauci was having discussions about both lab-leak and engineered-virus possibilities as early as Feb 2020 (the emails revealed that), but this kind of genetic evidence takes time to develop, and cannot be announced publicly (Imagine him saying:  "hey, see, I am looking at lab-leak possibility although there is very little evidence!  I am sure more evidence will be available in 2021!" - and then it turns out to be false. Would start WWIII.). Even now, he is not buying into any one explanation - no real scientist would.  But, with the bat-theory going nowhere, and a bit more information coming out from WIV, the needle has shifted in the other direction.    

 

Am sorry for the verbosity, but I think this issue deserves details.  Appreciate all of your patience if you are making it to the end of these posts! 

Edited by BacktoCricaddict
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vvvslaxman Grand Master

vvvslaxman

Posted
Posted
On 6/11/2021 at 7:22 AM, BacktoCricaddict said:

First, my post above was about the claim that that the virus was engineered.  That is separate from the claim that says virus leaked from a lab.  So, Fauci debunking the IIT pre-print's "engineered" claim back then, and being open to the lab-leak hypothesis now is not an example of a 180.

 

Second, Fauci never discounted the lab-leak hypothesis. I know you (or anyone else) don't have the time to check out all my posts (and am too lazy to find them now), but I have posted in other threads about this: that the early evidence was pointing towards bat-pangolin origins.  The reason those were pursued vigorously by scientists is because there is precedence for this kind of zoonotic virus jump (SARS 1, MERS etc) - any detective will go with what they think is most likely based on past experiences.  But when those leads were going nowhere, alternative explanations started to get more attention.  Moreover (again, posted here on ICF at some point), Fauci was having discussions about both lab-leak and engineered-virus possibilities as early as Feb 2020 (the emails revealed that), but this kind of genetic evidence takes time to develop, and cannot be announced publicly (Imagine him saying:  "hey, see, I am looking at lab-leak possibility although there is very little evidence!  I am sure more evidence will be available in 2021!" - and then it turns out to be false. Would start WWIII.). Even now, he is not buying into any one explanation - no real scientist would.  But, with the bat-theory going nowhere, and a bit more information coming out from WIV, the needle has shifted in the other direction.    

 

Am sorry for the verbosity, but I think this issue deserves details.  Appreciate all of your patience if you are making it to the end of these posts! 

Fauci is used as a scapegoat by Republicans so that Trump's covid handling will not impact his re-run 2024 forgetting the fact he did far worse things like Jan 6th.

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gattaca Veteran

gattaca

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

Fauci is used as a scapegoat by Republicans so that Trump's covid handling will not impact his re-run 2024 forgetting the fact he did far worse things like Jan 6th.


You funny man. You really think trump will run in 2024 ? Even republicans will not vote for him for jan 6th.

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