If Saini is not picked for the 3rd test despite 3 frontline quick bowlers missing, it is effectively a vote of no confidence regarding Saini without any basis

[express bowling]

1.  3 of our frontline quick bowlers are missing due to injury.  And there are talks of either Shardul or Natarajan being picked as the 3rd pacer.

 

2.  Saini is a fast bowler who was the original choice in the test squad. 

 

3.  Saini has come up the ranks ... chosen in the test squad because he has done well in FC cricket and Unofficial tests for India-A. His is a proper systemic selection.

----   And he has been trained to bowl 20+ overs a day with pace and intensity.

 

4.  He can bowl 140 k to 150 k. Can bowl nasty bouncer barrages, which can come in handy on the flat SCG pitch.

 

5.  Did well in the first innings of the practice match. Did not bowl well in the 2nd innings though 

 

6.   If he is still not picked in the playing 11 for the first test, it will be a vote of strong no-confidence regarding the 28 year old quick by the Team Management.

 

7.  And may shatter his confidence and end his test career. He is already 28 ... if he can't be picked with 3 frontline quicks missing, he will never be picked in the near future for test matches.

 

8.  There are talks of Shardul being played because of his batting ability. 

----   Shardul has a highest score of 22 from 29 international games and 15 from 45 IPL matches. Saini has a highest score of 45 from a handful of international games. Saini has some batting ability too.

----   It is incorrect to pick a specialist bowler, batting at No.9, based on his batting ability.

 

9.  It is possible that Saini plays and does not do well. But the same risk is there regarding Shardul or Natarajan to a greater extent.

 

10.  Saini is the original choice and the quicker and taller pacer. And a good pacer in the 5 day format. He deserves to be chosen based on that. Shardul and Natarajan lack the pace and height that is usually needed test matches played on Australian pitches.

 

 

11.  If Saini is not thought to be good at the moment, then why was he picked in all the 3 squads ????   Where is the talent evaluation ability of the people choosing the squad  ??  

 

12.  I hope the test playing 11 is not picked based on performances in ODIs and T20Is. This is totally wrong.

 

Shardul and Natarajan were not selected in the original test squad ... and after that, none of the 2 seamers have played a single FC match to prove that they have suddenly become better in this format.

 

13. Saini had back spasms when he was expensive in the 2 ODIs. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 4, 2021 by express bowling

[NameGoesHere]

I totally agree.  And in another thread I had referenced an article where even Natarajan's head coach was lukewarm on his selection:

 

https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/cricket/test-cricket-t-natarajan-test-squad-india-vs-australia-odi-t20i-tamil-nadu-umesh-yadav-7129547/

 

[jf1gp_1]

If Shaw is dropped after 1 test despite India's struggle with openers and Rohit missing, it is effectively a vote of no confidence regarding the young opener by TM

[kubrickian]

You cant pick someone just because you want to give them confidence. If the captain and TM dont have the confidence to pick him, its a fair call on their part. They are not obligated.

Its about fielding your best X1 which can win the game. 

[RAZPOR]

2 minutes ago, kubrickian said:

You cant pick someone just because you want to give them confidence. If the captain and TM dont have the confidence to pick him, its a fair call on their part. They are not obligated.

Its about fielding your best X1 which can win the game. 

I am sorry but if your assessment is that shardul is a better choice based on his loi exploits , which arent much to write about either then i disagree.

Also to suggest that team management knows better is laughable,when they have over last few years not managed to establish not one player thats been introduced in the squad,even the really good ones have been mishandled.

Compare this with how Cameron green is being handled by CA and what dividends thier handling of pat cummins has paid them.

TM is not always right ,infact in our case they are 90% wrong and its an open documented fact.

[express bowling]

19 hours ago, kubrickian said:

You cant pick someone just because you want to give them confidence. If the captain and TM dont have the confidence to pick him, its a fair call on their part. They are not obligated.

Its about fielding your best X1 which can win the game. 

 

 

True.  

 

If an obviously better bowler is available then pick him. Does not matter whose confidence is affected.

 

In this case, there isn't.

 

There is no logic or reason to think that Shardul or Natarajan are better test match bowlers than Saini. That too in Australia.

 

If they were thought to be better test match bowlers than Saini then why were they not picked in the initial test squad. ?

 

They have not played any FC matches in the meantime to prove that they are better FC bowlers.

 

Which is why I have referred to the possibility of choosing the test 11 based on LOI performances ... which is wrong.

Edited January 3, 2021 by express bowling

[kubrickian]

Navdeep Saini hasnt helped his case by performing poorly in the tour games and ODIs. At this point, think even Kuldeep Yadav wont be a bad option considering he picked a 5fer last time he played in Sydney. But think 3 spinners will be an overkill. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

Rahane made the right calls in the last test. Expecting him to do the same at SCG as well. Kohli discarded Saini too soon, like he's done with many players. Rahane will be lot more pragmatic.

 

As someone wrote on one of the threads, 3rd pacer names being thrown around could just be a ploy to keep the Aussies guessing.

[Adamant]

But but i thought Virat was the reason behind picking Shardul Thakur. 

 

Posters here don't realize that there is a strong Mumbai lobby  behind this guy. 

 

 

If Thakur plays ahead of Saini or Natrajan, i am sure it will cause huge uproar amongst the fans and critics. 

 

 

[Adamant]

1 minute ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Rahane made the right calls in the last test. Expecting him to do the same at SCG as well. Kohli discarded Saini too soon, like he's done with many players. Rahane will be lot more pragmatic.

 

As someone wrote on one of the threads, 3rd pacer names being thrown around could just be a ploy to keep the Aussies guessing.

When did Kohli discard Saini? 

Now don't bring a random odi here, you and me both know what's the meaning of discarding someone. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

3 minutes ago, Adamant said:

When did Kohli discard Saini? 

Now don't bring a random odi here, you and me both know what's the meaning of discarding someone. 

Using two poor performances in ODIs to not play him in a single T20I in Australia despite Saini doing so well in T20Is in his short career. Earlier as well, he chose to give Thakur a test debut despite Saini being in better form.

 

All this has been discussed to death in other threads. Not going to repeat all that.

[Adamant]

Just now, ShoonyaSifar said:

Using two poor performances in ODIs to not play him in a single T20I in Australia despite Saini doing so well in T20Is in his short career. Earlier as well, he chose to give Thakur a test debut despite Saini being in better form.

 

All this has been discussed to death in other threads. Not going to repeat all that.

That's because he wanted him to play practice matches in order to prepare for tests. 

[MechEng]

Saini is playing. He was in a restaurant with confirmed players of the team.

[putrevus]

Why you think Saini is not going to play. There is nobody else there.If they select Natarajan, TM should get their heads examined.

[tweaker]

Saini, Siraj should have made debut 2,3 years back.Now Ishant,Shami ,Umesh are injured so it's expected that Saini should make debut in the test.

 

His odi performance should not be held against him and Shardul should not be in  recogning due to his presumed batting qualities.

[putrevus]

17 minutes ago, tweaker said:

Saini, Siraj should have made debut 2,3 years back.Now Ishant,Shami ,Umesh are injured so it's expected that Saini should make debut in the test.

 

His odi performance should not be held against him and Shardul should not be in  recogning due to his presumed batting qualities.

If they hold his odi performances against him, then they should not be managing the team. 

[ViruDilSeKhelo]

I disagree and for once I am backing the TM if they do not choose Saini. The guy has done nothing of note recently, form is absolutely important going into a test match. He was leaking runs in limited overs and the practise games. I don't want a guy getting a cap who is going into the game like this and will probably leak runs at 4 per over and take the whole momentum away, at least Yadav had experience of striking now and then even outside SC. If Warner plays he will enjoy and even Smith, will enjoy 140kmph buffet bowling on a patta to get back into form.

 

SCG is a nice patta and the TM are more thinking to choose a FIFTH BOWLER and that is the difference here. Jaddu, Ashwin will get a lot of overs and there will always be one pacer at a time whether Siraj or Bumrah. The 5th bowler will simply play a supportive role, max 10-12 overs, must be tight and ideally bat a bit as we are light there with no tail and kohli. 

 

Personally I wish to see either Natarajan given a cap and told you will not be judged no matter what or Thakur or Kuldeep. Kuldeep may be an excellent pick if it happens, can also score 20 runs and bat with a recognised guy, SCG spins.  We have to be practical, there isn't a Shami/Ishant/Yadav who can be the 3rd pacer. It's not the Vinay Kumar at Perth fiasco because even if Thakur comes in, he's the 5th bowler, that's the point. I am not a fan of Thakur in any format but right now  we don't have many choices.

[Vk1]

why do some people think that Thakur/Kuldeep could contribute with bat against this attack?

[Lone Wolf]

The way selectors & TM have handled Siraj & Saini all these years it will be no surprise that Shardul plays over Saini.  I didn't knew but Thakur has a debut test vs WI at home lol..  The reason I don't know is that Thakur only bowled hardly 10min & limped off..  Lol. 

The thing that has been happening to these guys will pass on to Prasidh & Mavi.  I have no idea why Prasidh is not in Australia despite so many injuries happening.  Why didn't he travelled to Australia along with Rohit?  

[express bowling]

20 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said:

The way selectors & TM have handled Siraj & Saini all these years it will be no surprise that Shardul plays over Saini.  I didn't knew but Thakur has a debut test vs WI at home lol..  The reason I don't know is that Thakur only bowled hardly 10min & limped off..  Lol. 

The thing that has been happening to these guys will pass on to Prasidh & Mavi.  I have no idea why Prasidh is not in Australia despite so many injuries happening.  Why didn't he travelled to Australia along with Rohit?  

 

 

Exactly  !

 

Prasidh should have been sent to Australia with Rohit.