Question for those ever ready to P--- on IPL

[Serpico]

16 minutes ago, deathmonger said:

We are in the same place the Chinese were in the mid 2000s

how? china in mid 2000s was preparing for hosting next olympics, training the largest olympic contingent. They pretty much began their new silk road plans at that point. Their industrialization was close to completion at that time, while we are still competing with the likes of vietnam for "attracting" foreign investments. Even literacy/HDI wise we are not close to china in mid 2000s

[Serpico]

20 minutes ago, deathmonger said:

Most Americans consider the NBA more prestigious than Basketball World Cups.

 

The day more Indians consider the IPL more important and IPL absolutely dwarfs international cricket (on the way towards that) IPL will become real cricket

yeah and now NBA is getting lowest ratings in recent times as Americans got bored with competing among themselves.

 

Americans are trying to take their domestic games to other countries like Japan, while we are fantasizing about making a somewhat global game entirely local so that we can play among ourselves. sums up the ambitions 

[rollingstoned]

6 minutes ago, zen said:

Note that change and progress is everywhere even in Africa. 
 

There is a lot of work that needs to be done in India (don’t want to write an essay here). Cricket should not be a priority. 

 

huh yes, but obviously not to the same extent unless you admit you are grossly misinformed. i suppose we should stop playing cricket also then, akin to not spending money on anything unless it is a hospital or a school?

 

the topic you and the other guy want to start requires another thread but all you provide in the name of analysis are oversimplified tautologies and played cliches which you want to pass off as reality. It doesn't take much digging to know what's what in this regard.

 

[ShoonyaSifar]

7 minutes ago, deathmonger said:

The only reason other countries were able to compete with India was cause of poverty.

 

Assuming 6-7% growth rates India will be a 20 trillion economy by mid century. BCCI and Indian cricket's power will be absolute. 32 team IPL playing for 8 months a year.

The IPL haters have been predicting it's demise since 2008. But to their utter shock, it keeps growing and getting bigger and bigger every year. More they curse it, larger it becomes. Their pain is evident from the salty posts on this thread.

[zen]

1 minute ago, rollingstoned said:

huh yes, but obviously not to the same extent unless you admit you are grossly misinformed. i suppose we should stop playing cricket also then, akin to not spending money on anything unless it is a hospital or a school?

 

the topic you and the other guy want to start requires another thread but all you provide in the name of analysis are oversimplified tautologies and played cliches which you want to pass off as reality. It doesn't take much digging to know what's what in this regard.

 

First let’s start by showing respect to the region by not turning sacred rivers into sewers. 

 

Countries with clout do not need their people to advertise that. As the saying goes - empty vessels make the most noise. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

12 minutes ago, Serpico said:

how? china in mid 2000s was preparing for hosting next olympics, training the largest olympic contingent. They pretty much began their new silk road plans at that point. Their industrialization was close to completion at that time, while we are still competing with the likes of vietnam for "attracting" foreign investments. Even literacy/HDI wise we are not close to china in mid 2000s

China's FDI in 2005: 72 bilion dollars

India's FDI in 2020-21: 81 billion dollars (despite covid)

 

 

[Gollum]

I used to avoid IPL till circa (late) 2019 except highlights of KLR's batting, then @Mariyam converted me, opened my eyes, grateful for that. Now I do dawah to invite more people to embrace this wonderful league.

[maniac]

Firstly I don’t see that much difference in feeling proud about Google or Microsoft having Indian ceos to how much revenue the IPL generates or how rich Virat Kohli is.

 

I am a fan of the team I support and want them to win and do well, be it India or a franchise club I like. More than that I need entertainment that I enjoy and caters to me which is cricket .That’s what makes me pay for subscriptions to watch cricket, spend time on forums, cricket channels on social media. I really don’t care about ECB,ICC or any other board that has politics and conflicts with BCCI. Not my problem. Yes if they are hurting my chances as a viewer to watch a good game or a series, I have a beef with them. That’s about it.

 

Now people might say what about PCB or Pakistan cricket team. That’s a government level decision and has nothing to do with cricket governance itself. So as an Indian, I endorse the government stand and the reasons they have given for it. That’s the only exception.

 

Rest, I am upset that I didn’t get to watch a test match from a series that has been a blockbuster to watch in terms of quality and on field action and I would be equally upset if the IPL which is the highest form of T20 cricket is postponed or doesn’t go ahead as scheduled. That’s about it.

 

Rest like who is bullying who and who is feeding who and how much political stakes BCCI has gained or lost is none of my business. Yes, it makes for entertaining reading on the forum that’s about it. Doesn’t really affect my life.

 

Some posters here take this way to seriously. I can tell you right now if you look at BCCI in isolation,  without making it a measuring contest with other boards, you will find a lot of corrupt and inept jackasses there as well who don’t deserve the job.

 

All these years of lucrative IPL and what exactly has IPl given as an innovation to cricket?

 

Third umpiring started in South Africa, stump mics, spider cams etc are an Aussie innovation, T20 originated in England  and any innovative tweaks to the rules are happening in England and Australian tournaments.

 

Who gives a f about the politics in the background. Give me quality cricket.
 

on the flip side If you don’t like watching IPl then either adapt or get out.

 

No one seems to care about the cricket itself instead of this background noise.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 12, 2021 by maniac

[rollingstoned]

57 minutes ago, zen said:

First let’s start by showing respect to the region by not turning sacred rivers into sewers. 

 

Countries with clout do not need their people to advertise that. As the saying goes - empty vessels make the most noise. 

Go keep abreast of what's happening yourself. 

 

Countries with clout tend to also have people from the self same country shitting on it needlessly out of their own sense of inferiority who incidentally make such noises to seem more holier than thou, as if only they care. When such ignorant and misguided notions are corrected it will obviously feel like 'advertisement'.

Edited September 12, 2021 by rollingstoned

[deathmonger]

1 hour ago, Serpico said:

how? china in mid 2000s was preparing for hosting next olympics, training the largest olympic contingent. They pretty much began their new silk road plans at that point. Their industrialization was close to completion at that time, while we are still competing with the likes of vietnam for "attracting" foreign investments. Even literacy/HDI wise we are not close to china in mid 2000s

 

olympics is different cause communist governments like china try and get validity by performing exceptionally well in sports and have camps etc. similar to east germany beating USA in olympics during the cold war.

in fact they were getting insane medals in 1984 when they were even poorer than us.

 

hdi/literacy rate we are the same. industrialization hardly close to completion.

 

India's current HDI - 0.645.

China - 0.64 in 2005

 

India current gdp per capita - 6681 PPP $

China - 5299 PPP $ in 2005

 

http://hdr.undp.org/sites/all/themes/hdr_theme/country-notes/IND.pdf

http://hdr.undp.org/sites/all/themes/hdr_theme/country-notes/CHN.pdf

 

By 2005 China had only 9 metros (Beijing, Tianjin, Shanghai, Guangzhou, Dalian, Wuhan, Chongqing, Shenzen, Nanjing) and the last 4 came up in 2004-05 so must have less stations. All others came up around 2010.

We have around 12-13.

 

If you compare other metrics like space travel etc everywhere the timeline will be 15ish years.

 

So we are basically around China circa 2006-07.

 

The great China infrastructure push happened in the 2010s which will happen for us in the 2020s-early 2030s.

 

Edited September 12, 2021 by deathmonger

[deathmonger]

6 minutes ago, rollingstoned said:

Go keep abreast of what's happening yourself. 

 

Countries with clout tend to also have people from the self same country shitting on it needlessly out of their own sense of inferiority who incidentally make such noises to seem more holier than thou, as if only they care. When such ignorant and misguided notions are corrected it will obviously feel like 'advertisement'.

mostly people who live overseas and feel inferior in the company of whites.

[ShoonyaSifar]

Not at all surprising to see that some IPL haters are India haters as well. Again not very surprising that this group mostly lives outside India and perhaps their only connect to India is relatives and friends here.

 

More pain ahead for these jokers (who are a minority even on this forum).

[maniac]

13 minutes ago, rollingstoned said:

 

Countries with clout tend to also have people from the self same country shitting on it needlessly out of their own sense of inferiority who incidentally make such noises to seem more holier than thou, as if only they care. When such ignorant and misguided notions are corrected it will obviously feel like 'advertisement'.

I have no dog in this fight but where would you draw a line where IPL can be criticized or can’t?

 

I am a huge IPL fan (of the cricket and the players)  and  there are 10 things I can think of which frustrate me about the IPL and makes me embarrassed as well. 
 

I have as much of  an issue with people who don’t give IPl a chance or accept it for what it is as I have with people who take it personally when someone criticizes the IPL.

 

12+ years and apart from annoying jumping jhapaak and irritating plastic pancake faced bollywood celebrities, I don’t see IPL bringing in anything to cricket. Yes there is money which makes the players rich. That is not my problem. Good for them.

[zen]

27 minutes ago, rollingstoned said:

Go keep abreast of what's happening yourself. 

 

Countries with clout tend to also have people from the self same country shitting on it needlessly out of their own sense of inferiority who incidentally make such noises to seem more holier than thou, as if only they care. When such ignorant and misguided notions are corrected it will obviously feel like 'advertisement'.

 

Many Pakistanis will educate us on the clout of that country as well, making us believe that they have the push button to start WW3. People in BD, SL and Bhutan will say that their GDP per capita is better, and so on.  In subcon, people dump garbage on streets and mental garbage on social media ... Difficult to look at how deep the pocket are or clout is with so much garbage around ... Pardon me for being not too "enthusiastic" to such claims among all the noise.

 

Even from a religious angle, I am proud that India is a land of so many Gods. But also upset that despite so many Gods, the people have not learned much. 

 

 

Edited September 12, 2021 by zen

[express bowling]

[rollingstoned]

29 minutes ago, maniac said:

I have no dog in this fight but where would you draw a line where IPL can be criticized or can’t?

 

I am a huge IPL fan (of the cricket and the players)  and  there are 10 things I can think of which frustrate me about the IPL and makes me embarrassed as well. 
 

I have as much of  an issue with people who don’t give IPl a chance or accept it for what it is as I have with people who take it personally when someone criticizes the IPL.

 

12+ years and apart from annoying jumping jhapaak and irritating plastic pancake faced bollywood celebrities, I don’t see IPL bringing in anything to cricket. Yes there is money which makes the players rich. That is not my problem. Good for them.

I'm not a massive ipl apologist to take criticism of it personally but you can't deny the security it has given domestic players and the number of players it has encouraged to take up cricket as a profession. Administratively it gives us massive leverage too in the cricketing world which can't be understated. I don't think it has anything to do with patriotism personally though I tend not to be as much of a snob about it as I used to be and have thus softened my own previously held disdain for it. 

 

 

[rollingstoned]

39 minutes ago, zen said:

 

Many Pakistanis will educate us on the clout of that country as well, making us believe that they have the push button to start WW3. People in BD, SL and Bhutan will say that their GDP per capita is better, and so on.  In subcon, people dump garbage on streets and mental garbage on social media ... Difficult to look at how deep the pocket are or clout is with so much garbage around ... Pardon me for being not too "enthusiastic" to such claims among all the noise.

 

Even from a religious angle, I am proud that India is a land of so many Gods. But also upset that despite so many Gods, the people have not learned much. 

 

 

What do what random nobodies say have to do with what was being discussed ? If you're going to do sweeping generalisations you might as well try and get it right. Every assertion can be verified before you dismiss it with the same laziness as you make the same platitudes which got corrected. Delusions die a very horrible death eventually as our padosis you referred to keep finding out but not learning. We don't suffer the same issues at all, I can say that quite confidently. 

 

This has nothing to do with religion. No need to bring it into the discussion. It's one non sequitur after another. 

Edited September 12, 2021 by rollingstoned

[zen]

19 minutes ago, rollingstoned said:

What do what random nobodies say have to do with what was being discussed ? If you're going to do sweeping generalisations you might as well try and get it right. Every assertion can be verified before you dismiss it with the same laziness as you make the same platitudes which got corrected. Delusions die a very horrible death eventually as our padosis you referred to keep finding out but not learning. We don't suffer the same issues at all, I can say that quite confidently. 

 

The point was that takes like yours on India are no different from what I hear from others on their country (no matter how strongly you feel about your points.) ... I understand the patriotic zeal as in the past, driven by patriotic zeal too,  I have written articles like "India, an Asian Tiger" as well (including points on becoming competitive with China in manufacturing as well) ...  But as I said, "pardon me, ..." 

 

 

19 minutes ago, rollingstoned said:

This has nothing to do with religion. No need to bring it into the discussion. It's one non sequitur after another. 

 

It was a side note, highlighting some of the bigger challenges (the mindset) that the region faces wrt what was alluded in that post. 

Edited September 12, 2021 by zen

[rollingstoned]

8 minutes ago, zen said:

The point was that takes like yours on India are no different from what I hear from others on their country (no matter how strongly you feel about your points.) ... I understand the patriotic zeal as in the past, driven by patriotic zeal too,  I have written articles like "India, an Asian Tiger" as well (including points on becoming competitive with China in manufacturing as well) ...  But as I said, "pardon me, ..." 

 

And again the point is what they assert has no meaning or relevance to what is being discussed here, that sweeping generalisation is meaningless without also taking into account whether the claims are quantifiable and to what extent they stand upto scrutiny. the opposite of self loathing is not patriotic zeal, even ignoring that it is not a bad thing as such. A response to your binary assertion can't be brushed aside with straw men like others also make similar claims,etc. that is your interpretation with no bearing on what the facts may be.

 

[zen]

1 hour ago, rollingstoned said:

And again the point is what they assert has no meaning or relevance to what is being discussed here, that sweeping generalisation is meaningless without also taking into account whether the claims are quantifiable and to what extent they stand upto scrutiny. the opposite of self loathing is not patriotic zeal, even ignoring that it is not a bad thing as such. A response to your binary assertion can't be brushed aside with straw men like others also make similar claims,etc. that is your interpretation with no bearing on what the facts may be.

 

 

Buddy, as I said such posts will not resonate with me. Try your "facts" in India (or Pak or BD or SL for respective fans) where you may find like-minded people agreeing with you (may even get a pat for your patriotism) 

 

As for self-loathing (or whatever term you may want to use), I actually love myself and India  but do not appreciate how a great region has been turned into garbage. 

 

 

Edited September 12, 2021 by zen