Thank you Bangladesh

[sandeep]

and New Zealand.  

 

For delivering some quality performances against an Indian team that nicely shines a spotlight on some flaws in the Indian white ball setup.  Flaws that have been visible for quite some time, but have been ignored by the folks in charge.  

 

I strongly believe that the problem with the sub-optimal W/L results with the Indian team are not a result of lack of player resources, but a direct consequence of flawed tactics, flawed selection and flawed team management. 

 

We have seen a consistent pattern of inertia and conservatism in the Indian cricket team especially in the white ball formats.  This conservatism, refusal to modernize, and stubborn refusal to allow young talent the space and opportunity to prosper - both with the bat and the ball, is the primary reason that India has not dominated cricket like it can. 

 

The only way that the Indian team finally makes changes in tactics and/or selection, is when it is forced to do so - either due to injury, or due to 'major' losses.  It took an unexpected loss in the 2017 CT final, to finally get the Indian team to wake up and recognize that wrist spinners were the way to go in ODI cricket.  No matter that Ash and Jaddu were putting up years and years of middling to mediocre to bad performances - only when the team got slapped in the final did it finally usher in the era of "KulCha".   

 

These losses to NZ and to Bangladesh is the bitter medicine that the team is badly in need of.  A slap to the face and a wake up call ahead of the ODI WC. I have been repeatedly saying on this forum for the last 2 years that India is on track to be the first ODI WC host to fail to win the Trophy in almost 2 decades.  Maybe, just maybe, these losses will be the trigger to some long overdue changes that are needed in the team.

 

Dhawan's fate may have been finally sealed, making some room in the top order.  Unfortunately Shubman Gill isn't left handed, and neither is Prithvi Shaw - my dark horse contender for opening Indian batting in the home WC - Gill is in the Virat Kohli mould of consolidated risk management school of white ball batting, not the demolition man that's seriously needed in Indian white ball batting.  Now simply jettisoning Dhawan may not be enough - we need to ring in a bunch of changes to get the Indian train back on track.  

 

But imagine the situation if Indian team had managed to squeak out a win in either or both of these Bangladesh games - both games were extremely winnable for Ind - and if Mehdi does not bat out of his skin in either game, India would have escaped embarassment.

 

So a genuine, giant thank you to Mehdi and Bangladesh - thank you Bongaali bhai log, enjoy the sweet taste of victory.

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

Yeah, nothing is gonna happen. They've mostly made up their mind on who's going to play the World Cup and they're going to keep giving them games until the World Cup.

[zen]

BD should have won the T20 WC game against Ind too … Were put off track by the weather 

 

But that was a blessing in disguise as the India (with its conservative and outdated top 3, trundling attack, and a lack of a wrist spinner) was exposed at the big stage  in SF 

 

Jaisi karni waisi bharni 

[zen]

 

[rkt.india]

3 minutes ago, TNAmarkFromIndia said:

Yeah, nothing is gonna happen. They've mostly made up their mind on who's going to play the World Cup and they're going to keep giving them games until the World Cup.

Dhawan Rohit Kohli Rahul pandya fixed top 5. Top 3 are playing regularly since 2013. Their third odi WC together. In bowling only Bumrah if fit is a certainty. 

[vvvslaxman]

So many matches i have seen BD fans crying inconsolaby, even players. Hope this heals those past wounds. Nidahas Trophy they were in even more dominating situation and lost it. Then that 3 wicket pandya over, Dhoni finish,  Pandya finish. Lost so many close matches to India.  It should give something to cheer about. India winning this won't really make any fan go delirious anyway. Loss sure will jolt this loserish set up.

[Frustrated]

Till now there is no sign of Dhawan or Kohli or KL getting the boot ,despite the Odi series loss to Bangladesh and Nz(earlier).  All this thanksgiving to Ban and Nz could turn out to be little premature, as of now.  

[vvvslaxman]

10 minutes ago, Frustrated said:

Till now there is no sign of Dhawan or Kohli or KL getting the boot ,despite the Odi series loss to Bangladesh and Nz(earlier).  All this thanksgiving to Ban and Nz could turn out to be little premature, as of now.  

 

They wanted to take part here to statpad lol Backfired

[jalebi_bhai]

Love the optimism but let's be real....

 

Khakk nahin honewaala. 

 

A few media reports about BCCI being pissed will start floating around. Players and management will regurgitate platitutdes in the press conference and it will be business as usual. 

 

BCCI is not serious about making India the best team in the world, we shouldn't fret too much either.

 

Bas tamasha dekho.

[sandeep]

1 hour ago, TNAmarkFromIndia said:

Yeah, nothing is gonna happen. They've mostly made up their mind on who's going to play the World Cup and they're going to keep giving them games until the World Cup.

Don't be so negative, strife and embarrassment opens the door for growth.  And I have enough faith in the intentions of Indian cricket stakeholders - where the on the field stuff is concerned - that they will eventually get it right - once they are forced out of their inertia and conservative methodology.  Have been advocating and waiting for it since 2015. Some of youse are waking up more recently....

[sandeep]

35 minutes ago, jalebi_bhai said:

Love the optimism but let's be real....

 

Khakk nahin honewaala. 

 

A few media reports about BCCI being pissed will start floating around. Players and management will regurgitate platitutdes in the press conference and it will be business as usual. 

 

BCCI is not serious about making India the best team in the world, we shouldn't fret too much either.

 

Bas tamasha dekho.

Don't want die-hards like you to turn into such hard core cynics.  Thoda Optimism necessary hai, especially when losing back to back games with toygers.

[vvvslaxman]

1 minute ago, sandeep said:

Don't want die-hards like you to turn into such hard core cynics.  Thoda Optimism necessary hai, especially when losing back to back games with toygers.

 

Especially when whitewashing BD will get absolutely no credit anyway lol  In the long run when fans use filter they will exclude these stats. It is good to get thrashed by lower ranked sides like this.

[sandeep]

51 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

They wanted to take part here to statpad lol Backfired

Karma is a byytch....

 

Dhawan's career has come full circle - I still remember the ODI series in Windies post 2011 WC, he was trying to establish himself and the trinidad pitch was quite BD-like in the low and inconsistent bounce - totally unsuited to his batting method - he was salty about it for many years after the fact.  Its funny how his ODI career I think is ending in similar conditions.  At least lets hope the Indian team takes this opportunity to turn the page.  He's had 2-3 series back to back, to try and make his case.  And failed.

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

10 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Don't be so negative, strife and embarrassment opens the door for growth. 

Any major changes will happen only after 2023 World Cup. Not before then.

[express bowling]

Dravid already said that hopefully he will get the full team by January.

 

So, the excuse in his mind is that he lost because there was no Hardik, Jadeja, Bumrah and Chahal. He thinks that his approach, tactics and team selection were ok. 

 

Why would he bother changing anything then unless he is thrown out and a new coach comes  !

[sandeep]

4 minutes ago, TNAmarkFromIndia said:

Any major changes will happen only after 2023 World Cup. Not before then.

I like it when folks exude such confident energy making predictions when they have absolutely no agency in the facts of the matter.  

 

I mean, I get it.  You are frustrated, and cynical.  But still...

[Nash]

 

 

this is now Pakistanis must be feeling since last 10 years.  Lol. 

[sandeep]

27 minutes ago, express bowling said:

Dravid already said that hopefully he will get the full team by January.

 

So, the excuse in his mind is that he lost because there was no Hardik, Jadeja, Bumrah and Chahal. He thinks that his approach, tactics and team selection were ok. 

 

Why would he bother changing anything then unless he is thrown out and a new coach comes  !

 

Jaddu should be nowhere near the T20 Indian team.  Even the ODI team - Sundar should play ahead of him unless injured.  

 

Boomrah and Pandya were papering over these cracks for quite some time.  I'm honestly happy that we lost both games.  Much better outcome for Indian cricket than facile meaningless wins with Dhawan scoring 80 SR century.

[putrevus]

 

3 hours ago, sandeep said:

and New Zealand.  

 

For delivering some quality performances against an Indian team that nicely shines a spotlight on some flaws in the Indian white ball setup.  Flaws that have been visible for quite some time, but have been ignored by the folks in charge.  

 

I strongly believe that the problem with the sub-optimal W/L results with the Indian team are not a result of lack of player resources, but a direct consequence of flawed tactics, flawed selection and flawed team management. 

 

We have seen a consistent pattern of inertia and conservatism in the Indian cricket team especially in the white ball formats.  This conservatism, refusal to modernize, and stubborn refusal to allow young talent the space and opportunity to prosper - both with the bat and the ball, is the primary reason that India has not dominated cricket like it can. 

 

The only way that the Indian team finally makes changes in tactics and/or selection, is when it is forced to do so - either due to injury, or due to 'major' losses.  It took an unexpected loss in the 2017 CT final, to finally get the Indian team to wake up and recognize that wrist spinners were the way to go in ODI cricket.  No matter that Ash and Jaddu were putting up years and years of middling to mediocre to bad performances - only when the team got slapped in the final did it finally usher in the era of "KulCha".   

 

These losses to NZ and to Bangladesh is the bitter medicine that the team is badly in need of.  A slap to the face and a wake up call ahead of the ODI WC. I have been repeatedly saying on this forum for the last 2 years that India is on track to be the first ODI WC host to fail to win the Trophy in almost 2 decades.  Maybe, just maybe, these losses will be the trigger to some long overdue changes that are needed in the team.

 

Dhawan's fate may have been finally sealed, making some room in the top order.  Unfortunately Shubman Gill isn't left handed, and neither is Prithvi Shaw - my dark horse contender for opening Indian batting in the home WC - Gill is in the Virat Kohli mould of consolidated risk management school of white ball batting, not the demolition man that's seriously needed in Indian white ball batting.  Now simply jettisoning Dhawan may not be enough - we need to ring in a bunch of changes to get the Indian train back on track.  

 

But imagine the situation if Indian team had managed to squeak out a win in either or both of these Bangladesh games - both games were extremely winnable for Ind - and if Mehdi does not bat out of his skin in either game, India would have escaped embarassment.

 

So a genuine, giant thank you to Mehdi and Bangladesh - thank you Bongaali bhai log, enjoy the sweet taste of victory.

What are those changes needed? IMO it is not at all a big deal to losses these match and nothing has been exposed also. Other Than dhawan there is not many changes in batting needed, bowling is where lot of changes should be done .

 

Bowling has stunk in white ball cricket since 2013. India never had a great white ball bowling attack. Rahul Dravid and KL Rahul both have to go and some one needs to make Pant opener and leave him there. Then batting is then set.

 

Rohit and Kohli have carried this team for over a decade without ever getting any help. Let us what help they get in 2023. They are still best odi batsmen in the country.

Edited December 8, 2022 by putrevus

[vvvslaxman]

14 minutes ago, putrevus said:

 

What are those changes needed? IMO it is not at all a big deal to losses these match and nothing has been exposed also. Other Than dhawan there is not change in batting needed, bowling is where lot of changes should be done .

 

Bowling has stunk in white ball cricket since 2013. India never had a great white ball bowling attack. Rahul Dravid and KL Rahul both have to go and some one needs to make Pant opener and leave him there. Then batting is then set.

 

Rohit and Kohli have carried this team for over a decade without ever getting any help. Let us what help they get in 2023. They are still best odi batsmen in the country.

 

Kohli's 2022 record is 18 average in 10 matches at a strike rate of 73. Dhoni played a very big part in finishing a lot of games with the help of Raina/Jadhav.  India cannot continue picking players on reputation. Jason Roy was the main man for England not so long ago. Few bad runs dropped immediately. Until India starts getting rid of these "reputation based selection" India will never win anything. 

 

India's problem is middle phase and end overs. Not being able to go for the kill in all formats.