How to make a balance between good players of spin and equally good batsmen against pace and bounce in Indian cricket

[Suhaan]

This has been our problem,it's been perhaps 20 years we have struggled against decent spin let alone quality spin

If we channel our focus on playing spin well like traditionally we had we may loose on pace and bounce

Ordering almost all the pitches to be ragers in domestics and dictating even the internationals playing domestics in free time may well hurt our pace and bounce preparation

Fast bowling which usually suffers may suffer further

So what can be done to strike the right balance,what the board may come up with or should they

We will loose more at home ,as we stare at transition

But in the longer run,this matters,our spinn playing has been Uber atrocious,each SENA side is better than us not talking about the Asian sides

@express bowling

@Mosher

@Lord

@singhvivek141

@Nikhil_cric

@Lone Wolf

@Need4Speed

@tweaker

@diga

@rkt.india

@Frustrated

@Vk1

@tapandrun and others ,share your thoughts

[tweaker]

There are many better players of spin in domestic cricket, but they are ignored.

The players who have directly selected from  u 19 teams and who have not played much domestic cricket are weak in playing spinners. 

Those who have experience of playing in Ranji matches ie Sarfaraj, Rinku ,are better at playing spinners. 

 

If Rohit,Virat,Rahul.had played in Duleep.Trophy ,their batting against spin would have improved.

 

If select Eashwaran,Sarfaraj, Parag,Rinku,Jurel, Nitish we may see they are far better players of spin.

[raki05]

20 minutes ago, tweaker said:

There are many better players of spin in domestic cricket, but they are ignored.

The players who have directly selected from  u 19 teams and who have not played much domestic cricket are weak in playing spinners. 

Those who have experience of playing in Ranji matches ie Sarfaraj, Rinku ,are better at playing spinners. 

 

If Rohit,Virat,Rahul.had played in Duleep.Trophy ,their batting against spin would have improved.

 

If select Eashwaran,Sarfaraj, Parag,Rinku,Jurel, Nitish we may see they are far better players of spin.

I remember past players used to play atlease few matches of domestic session and even board president xi game. Around 98 Sachin played board president xi game against aus before start of a test series. I have seen laxman, dravid all used to play few matches of domestic even hahane and khujara to an extent. But sooper issthar like Gill, Chokli, Sharma consider themselves above domestic.

[Suhaan]

4 minutes ago, raki05 said:

I remember past players used to play atlease few matches of domestic session and even board president xi game. Around 98 Sachin played board president xi game against aus before start of a test series. I have seen laxman, dravid all used to play few matches of domestic even hahane and khujara to an extent. But sooper issthar like Gill, Chokli, Sharma consider themselves above domestic.

Dhoni and koplie have taken hero worship to another universe

And BCCI bosses have pampered them so well that they get encouraged in a way

Like paxtani we are also heading towards overdose of t20 cricket

Appointment of Gambhir has coincided with attention being more paid to T20 cricket

I know earlier we used to complain about our subpar performance in shortest format,but you cannot just go with one format

You have to have some sort of plan layout to strike a balance

Tests cants be ignored no matter how unpopular they are as they are the building blocks of a nation's cricket

It takes time to develop test level cricketers

[tweaker]

Their superstar.status has gone to their head.This New zealand team has humbled them.

[Suhaan]

Just now, tweaker said:

Their superstar.status has gone to their head.This New zealand team has humbled them.

After Kohli Gill is there to be pampered who is 1/100th of his predecessor

jaiswal may well as well

Pant too looks like stubborn who doesn't want to iron out his deficiencies

The ecosystem is flawed

[singhvivek141]

Adding to what @tweaker has mentioned
1. Create variety of pitches, BCCI has so much money and India is such a geographically versatile state. Create Green Mambas, Spin rank turners, Flat pattas, bouncy pitches.
These will enable to identify which batter/bowler has success under what conditions. For ex...Gill can do well against bounce, but will struggle against spin and green pitches, jaiswal is good against spin and swing...but bounce can be a cause of concern.

2. Forget about looking for all format players, one size don't fit all. I know it's deeply ingrained in our cricketing system to look for one messiah superstar who will represent us in all formats. But that era is gone. Instead of creating one or two all format superstars, divide the strength and create multiple good players across formats. Use our population to our advantage.

3. Maybe controversial for some, but we need to reorganize our domestic teams. Ditch the so called "Railways, Services and other so called small teams which barely has enough 15 proper players". Some small states have 2 or even 3 teams, while larger states has only one. It needs a re-alignment.

[Mosher]

Like @raki05 and @tweaker said some of these superstar batman need to go back to domestic cricket when there is no international cricket and guys like Rinku, Jurel should be selected who are temperamentally strong and have a good technique against spin.

[Suhaan]

@raki05

@Gollum

@vvvslaxman

@Ultimate_Game

@neel roy

[Suhaan]

8 minutes ago, Mosher said:

Like @raki05 and @tweaker said some of these superstar batman need to go back to domestic cricket when there is no international cricket and guys like Rinku, Jurel should be selected who are temperamentally strong and have a good technique against spin.

Guys who become part of this side well "guided"by so called "shuppastars" become sheep with their midas touch

I know paindu Gill has no quality to be termed as shuppastar ,i really hope they aren't treated like one

Shuppastars are thing of the past really hope it ends with Kohli and Rohit

And hope they deliver more performances and feel the heat of repercussions

Edited October 26, 2024 by Suhaan

[R!TTER]

SRT played even till 2010's IIRC but of course IPL *****s don't care.

[express bowling]

1)   The answer lies in producing sporting tracks for domestic FC matches. Pitches which will help pacers for the first 2.5 days and help spinners for the last 1.5 days. 

 

2)  Make our international batters play some domestic matches from time to time. Play a couple of Duleep Trophy matches before the start of the home test season. 

[Vk1]

Spin troubles got exaggerated during Dravid's time. Dravid's email helped KP become a poor to great batsman overnight against spin but his direct on field coaching expertise has furthet ruined it

[Vk1]

I don't like the all format players. BCCI economics may dictate that but you cannot find players who are equally good at spin plus have ability to score 50 ball 100s. Having 2/3 all format players should be the limit. When was it the last time supposedly all format greats such as Kohli/Rohit were doing consistently well in all formats?

[jf1gp_1]

I don't think spin is the problem. You think Virat at his peak would have been troubles by santner ? He would have smashed him on this track 8 yrs ago. It's time to move on.

[Vk1]

3 minutes ago, jf1gp_1 said:

I don't think spin is the problem. You think Virat at his peak would have been troubles by santner ? He would have smashed him on this track 8 yrs ago. It's time to move on.

Virat Kohlis spin troubles have been going on for 5 years now

[Suhaan]

31 minutes ago, Vk1 said:

I don't like the all format players. BCCI economics may dictate that but you cannot find players who are equally good at spin plus have ability to score 50 ball 100s. Having 2/3 all format players should be the limit. When was it the last time supposedly all format greats such as Kohli/Rohit were doing consistently well in all formats?

All format players don't exist in India,dukandar BCCI will definitely want to save money by limiting player count across formats

That's why you will see guys like Gill,Ritu playing t20s

There should be even conditions specific players,no shame in getting few domestic guys on ragers

If we loose like this money will certainly disappear from BCCI's treasure

[Majestic]

54 minutes ago, Vk1 said:

Virat Kohlis spin troubles have been going on for 5 years now

This is Santner at its peak. He has observed what Jadeja did all these years and replicated the same.

[Frustrated]

As of now, I don't really know (as an Ind fan) what to say.  I m left speechless.  Many ICFers who follow domestic tournaments keenly hv been advocating for young batsman who average 60+ in domestic as replacement for oldies like Rohit and Kohli.  I hv been hearing Sarfaraz's name for almost 3 yrs.  But it is evident that he is not an intl material in the first place.   Sucks against spin.  Sucks against pace.  Good for Nothing.  Doesn't even hv the fitness to last one day on the field.  Same with Patidar.  I think our domestic structure is rotten.  Sorry to say, no amount of quality discussion is gonna help us when the entire system from top to bottom is rotten.  

[neel roy]

Difference between Santner and jadeja is santner is slower. These spinners get hit on flat decks but nightmare on spin tracks as the trajectory is very high. Also remember Santner has the arm

ball which comes from wide angle above a batsmans eye line. So when you see the ball coming to you looped up ur natural instict is to push forward but then suddenly the ball spins and takes your outside edge. The only way to tackle this is having both sweeps in play as no matter where the ball pitches you can just sweep and smother the spin which none of indians are experienced at. Pants run out was crucial. He could have scored at a quick rate being a leftie.