Why did Indian team under Ganguly lose so many finals?

[Trichromatic]

 

It's one thing to have poor record, but losing almost evey final and not getting another win even by fluke...

[SK_IH]

pathetic record,i remember lanka routinely beating our side in the finals

[Ankit_sharma03]

Nerves use to get on him, he use to fail in finals mentally . A captain body language will always rub on the team. Kohli body lang was also one of the reason we loss to pakistan and sarfraz was the reason they won. In a game things will go against u and thats were u have to keep calm and thats were dhoni was diff to many indian cricketers and captain. SA loose games as they let the moment get on to them and when u hear many players talk about dhoni they say he doesnt get affected , m sure deep down he wud but not showing helps the team be in calm.  

Same reason India have mostly gotten better of pakistan in WC as for pakistan beating india is everything so they take to much pressure on to them . In same world cup ull see a diff pak against other teams then India 

 

If u find the toss video of 2003wc final , see the diff between ganguly and ponting body language. 

[Gollum]

We weren't so strong back then. Besides you put this Kohli side against those Aussie (GOAT)/Lankan(damn good)/NZ (Bond) sides and we will still lose most of the finals. No way can the current Indian team beat that Aussie team (anywhere) or even NZ (Bondified + on a green top in Harare). SL may be they can split 50:50 at best. That Lankan team had Aravinda, Vaas, Murali, Sanath, Sanga, Jaya etc dare I say they look even more formidable than the present Indian team. 

 

More than other sides playing out of their skins, I think we were too wounded thanks to the whippings we took from Australia in half of those finals. Once you get pummeled so often it affects your psyche before finals against other teams. We were good enough to reach most of the finals in that period but simply not good enough to compete with Australia. Similar to how Federer was good enough to reach most RG finals in the 2005-08 period but not good enough to overcome Nadal on clay. That affected him mentally as he said recently in an interview, especially the beatdown in 2008 RG. Because of that he couldn't play his normal game and lost 2008 SW19 and 2009 AO on surfaces he had no business losing to a clay courter like Nadal (remember Nadal was still a clay specialist then with 0 non clay majors). It is all a mind game, I think that GOAT Aus team had a similar effect on the psyche of the ICT. Had we avoided them in that period may be we could have been more successful in the finals we were expected to win. 

Edited November 2, 2017 by Gollum

[SK_IH]

20 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Nerves use to get on him, he use to fail in finals mentally . A captain body language will always rub on the team. Kohli body lang was also one of the reason we loss to pakistan and sarfraz was the reason they won. In a game things will go against u and thats were u have to keep calm and thats were dhoni was diff to many indian cricketers and captain. SA loose games as they let the moment get on to them and when u hear many players talk about dhoni they say he doesnt get affected , m sure deep down he wud but not showing helps the team be in calm.  

Same reason India have mostly gotten better of pakistan in WC as for pakistan beating india is everything so they take to much pressure on to them . In same world cup ull see a diff pak against other teams then India 

 

If u find the toss video of 2003wc final , see the diff between ganguly and ponting body language. 

toss acha bahana banna aaj tak,either ways that Aus side would have destroyed our side ,they were miles better in every aspect

 

otherwise i agree with whatever you wrote

[velu]

Dhoni lost 2 finaks which we should have won .. sort of gifted the game to lanka and piss poor team selection against pakistan 

[Trichromatic]

47 minutes ago, Gollum said:

We weren't so strong back then.

People say that 1990s team was very weak, but contrary to popular opinion Azhar did win lot of ODI tournaments for us.

[Ankit_sharma03]

4 minutes ago, SK_IH said:

toss acha bahana banna aaj tak,either ways that Aus side would have destroyed our side ,they were miles better in every aspect

 

otherwise i agree with whatever you wrote

bahana nhin hai check krlo, yes its true most teams use to loose battle against that aussie side before getting on the field . His body language didnt help either .

Find that video and see the diff in him n ponting 

[maniac]

5 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

bahana nhin hai check krlo, yes its true most teams use to loose battle against that aussie side before getting on the field . His body language didnt help either .

Find that video and see the diff in him n ponting 

What happened to Dhoni’s body language in Wt20 2014???  or in Wt20 2016 seminfinal or WC 2015??? Or 3 first round knockouts in Wt20??? Or CT 2009??? Or in some other tournaments he lost

 

Simple a Captain is as good as his team....Sarfaraz has the worst body language for a captain...he himself is a mediocre cricketer and constantly yells and shouts at his teammates even at the slightest fumble.

 

His team won because they caught some good teams on an off day and credit to them they executed their plans well which probably  should be attributed to their coach.

 

Where a captain can make a difference is raise his game when it matters or totally out think the opposition when things are going South....Sure Dhoni has had a couple of those but saying he was the be all and end all of us winning tournaments is a BS theory.

 

Dhoni had a better team....simple.....Kohli has lost 1 final that’s it...Yes his post match attitude was poor but still has a long way to go.

Edited November 2, 2017 by maniac

[sandeep]

6 hours ago, velu said:

Dhoni lost 2 finaks which we should have won .. sort of gifted the game to lanka and piss poor team selection against pakistan 

I will hold him responsible for our poor showing in 2009 T20 world cup as well.  We had peak Yuvi and Yusuf Pathan at the time.  And he sent in Sir Jaddu to bat ahead of them to eat balls against England.  Shockingly poor captaincy from him.  

[Jimmy Cliff]

3 minutes ago, sandeep said:

I will hold him responsible for our poor showing in 2009 T20 world cup as well.  We had peak Yuvi and Yusuf Pathan at the time.  And he sent in Sir Jaddu to bat ahead of them to eat balls against England.  Shockingly poor captaincy from him.  

Not to mention his 11(23) against WI.

[sandeep]

3 minutes ago, Jimmy Cliff said:

Not to mention his 11(23) against WI.

I can forgive execution and performance issues - **** happens sometimes.  Does yuvi's failure in the T20 final mean he's a crap player? No.  He had a bad day.  But Dhoni the captain, especially in limited overs, has set a high standard for making decisions.  That decision, to send Jaddu in, was just bad on multiple levels.   And really an obvious one.  I think he was guilty of looking ahead of that game a bit, and decided to send Jadeja in to build some confidence.  Thinking that we can get this game, and we still have Yuvi and Yusuf to come who can tonk it.  Probably didn't expect Jaddu to struggle as badly as he did, and eat balls and not get out.  But that's a risk he should not have taken.  

[Jimmy Cliff]

17 minutes ago, sandeep said:

I can forgive execution and performance issues - **** happens sometimes.  Does yuvi's failure in the T20 final mean he's a crap player? No.  He had a bad day.  But Dhoni the captain, especially in limited overs, has set a high standard for making decisions.  That decision, to send Jaddu in, was just bad on multiple levels.   And really an obvious one.  I think he was guilty of looking ahead of that game a bit, and decided to send Jadeja in to build some confidence.  Thinking that we can get this game, and we still have Yuvi and Yusuf to come who can tonk it.  Probably didn't expect Jaddu to struggle as badly as he did, and eat balls and not get out.  But that's a risk he should not have taken.  

True. Was just trying to point out MSD screwed our chances in more ways than one in that WC. The Jadeja decision was terrible alright. Remember him trying his best to slog every other ball but barely clearing the 30-yard circle.

[Laaloo]

49 minutes ago, Jimmy Cliff said:

Not to mention his 11(23) against WI.

bhajji with a 13(4) knock

 

 

[Rasgulla]

Because he had chokers back in those days.. Can't blame him. We actually won 1 match out of 6 under sachin ? That's a surprise who did we pay that match against ? Uganda 

[Ankit_sharma03]

7 hours ago, maniac said:

What happened to Dhoni’s body language in Wt20 2014???  or in Wt20 2016 seminfinal or WC 2015??? Or 3 first round knockouts in Wt20??? Or CT 2009??? Or in some other tournaments he lost

Look no matter what who is the captain, u wnt win everything ......the gr8 aussie also finally lost.

Captain body lang also isnt eveything at the end of the day

Wc 20 2014 or 2016 - u play with one man army u wont last long in the tournament 

WC 2015- ur main bowler shami was carrying an injury and it was matter of time when an opp will put runs on board n boom. There wasnt much wrong with his body lang 

 

He didnt loose all final, ganguly pretty much lost all apart from natwest ............

7 hours ago, maniac said:

Simple a Captain is as good as his team....Sarfaraz has the worst body language for a captain...he himself is a mediocre cricketer and constantly yells and shouts at his teammates even at the slightest fumble.

Yes a captain is as good as a team but a good captain will always take a good team to diff level. Had the same team of dhoni played under sehwag thing wud have been diff

2013CT squad was weeker then 2017 Ct squad- so what happened there

 

u can be a **** cricketer but some of them know how to keep their nerves toghter, Sa is filled with gr8 player yet they choke 

7 hours ago, maniac said:

 

His team won because they caught some good teams on an off day and credit to them they executed their plans well which probably  should be attributed to their coach.

that can happen on one day but not every, lets give it to them they played good cricket those 3-4 days as a team. 

Execution is always to credit to players- Plan jo marzi banake aao field pe player ko hi execute krna hai 

7 hours ago, maniac said:

Where a captain can make a difference is raise his game when it matters or totally out think the opposition when things are going South....Sure Dhoni has had a couple of those but saying he was the be all and end all of us winning tournaments is a BS theory.

Never said that but these things play a role, no one thing or one player wins u games . Im even against the fact when people one player won us cup -BS whole team wins u cups 

7 hours ago, maniac said:

Dhoni had a better team....simple.....Kohli has lost 1 final that’s it...Yes his post match attitude was poor but still has a long way to go.

Kohli had a better team in 2017CT then dhoni 2013 CT.................

Look at the team of cb series 2007.......look at those names on aussie sheets and then ours ......we won 2-0

Infact our team was better then pakistan team in ct 2017 

 

i dnt consider that fun with opp bad as many here for me the nerves got onto kohli

Infact our team was 

 

Nerves in crunch games do play a cruical role 

BE it souarv in finals

Be it Sa in World tournaments

Be it pak against india in WC

 

 

Thats why words like pressure are used a lot in international cricketer . 

[Khota]

His peak coinicided with Aussies peak. It is same as running 100m during the era of Usain Bolt. Having said all that he was not fault free. The world cup final was a tactical mistake on his part. It shows poor prepration on the part of India. Playing all three pacers against Australia was a mistake, Kumble should have played that game. Games are about mismatches and taking advantage. He gave the advantage away by playing 3 pacers. It was a big tactical mistake.