How long will it take management to realize that Thakur and Chahar can't play in the same XI?

[jalebi_bhai]

I like them but they're at best utility players. Chahar can't bowl in the latter half of the innings and Thakur is not a prolific wicket taker. 

 

When will the management realize that at best you can only play one of them?

[vvvslaxman]

Thakur bowling is surprisingly okay except death. You have to pick side based on what they are going to do. New ball or middle overs or death overs.  You can't pick several new ball bowlers not a single death bowler

[Kohlifan]

after shameful exit from WC 23

[Lord]

The idea, I hope, is to play both and choose whoever does better in WC

 

Chahar though is forever injured

[jalebi_bhai]

4 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Thakur bowling is surprisingly okay except death. You have to pick side based on what they are going to do. New ball or middle overs or death overs.  You can't pick several new ball bowlers not a single death bowler

They are both good players but just not workable in the same line up simply because you can't trust them to bowl 10 overs consistently. 

 

They are competent with the bat but can't be considered specialist bowlers at ODI level. 

[jalebi_bhai]

1 minute ago, Lord said:

The idea, I hope, is to play both and choose whoever does better in WC

 

Chahar though is forever injured

That would be logical, which means that they're probably not thinking along those lines.

[rkt.india]

But batting bhi to koi aisi reliable nahi hai. Both crapped in the two games. Batted like proper tailenders.

[Number]

Chahar can't get out of NCA even for a week. He is gone now.

Edited December 7, 2022 by Number

[rkt.india]

2 minutes ago, Number said:

Chahar can't get out of NCA even for a week. He is gone now.

He is a 4 over bowler had said before too.

[putrevus]

1 minute ago, rkt.india said:

He is a 4 over bowler had said before too.

I really hope they give some consistent run to Kuldeep and Umran. Guys like Chahar just don't cut it in modern odis. Umran has to build his strength to last 10 overs.

[rkt.india]

40 minutes ago, putrevus said:

I really hope they give some consistent run to Kuldeep and Umran. Guys like Chahar just don't cut it in modern odis. Umran has to build his strength to last 10 overs.

Umran with his action should be able to bowl Yorkers if worked. Kuldeep has shown he can bowl Yorkers at death but execution under pressure isva different beast.

[The Realist]

Sicknote and Tubby

 

Mediocre journeymen

 

No thanks

[Majestic]

Neither should be in XI...they are fake all rounders.

 

Shardul has been a good Test match overseas all rounder but his test also starts now because using angles to pick up cheap wickets might not work anymore as batsman have seen him.

 

[cricketfan28]

youngsters should be given more time to adapt.

[putrevus]

55 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Umran with his action should be able to bowl Yorkers if worked. Kuldeep has shown he can bowl Yorkers at death but execution under pressure isva different beast.

What happened in  last two games has been happening quite frequently.Stiff back is due Kuldeep not consistently fit enough to even bowl 10 overs???

[jalebi_bhai]

Just to put things into a bit more perspective, I've looked at Thakur and Chahar's List A stats and found something that reinforces the belief of many icfers that neither of these two can play as specialist bowlers:

 

In List A:

Chahar avg balls per innings: 42.6 (~7 overs)

Thakur avg balls per innings: 46.3 (~7 n half overs)

 

The two of them don't even average 8 overs per innings over their List-A careers so how can we play them as specialist bowlers in ODIs?

 

Their sub 30 bowling averages hold when they bowl their career mean deliveries in a game. The moment they go above the mean deliveries, they start getting smashed.

 

They also don't average 20 with the bat. Thakur just falls short at 19 and Chahar is at 17.

 

Long story short, they are both contemporary ODI number 8s. Not good enough with the bat to bat higher, not good enough with the ball to be considered specialists. There is a place in the team for them, but just one of them.

 

I know cricket is not won on datasheets but when the numbers reflect actual performance trends, then we need to start paying heed.

[Vijy]

3 hours ago, jalebi_bhai said:

Just to put things into a bit more perspective, I've looked at Thakur and Chahar's List A stats and found something that reinforces the belief of many icfers that neither of these two can play as specialist bowlers:

 

In List A:

Chahar avg balls per innings: 42.6 (~7 overs)

Thakur avg balls per innings: 46.3 (~7 n half overs)

 

The two of them don't even average 8 overs per innings over their List-A careers so how can we play them as specialist bowlers in ODIs?

 

Their sub 30 bowling averages hold when they bowl their career mean deliveries in a game. The moment they go above the mean deliveries, they start getting smashed.

 

They also don't average 20 with the bat. Thakur just falls short at 19 and Chahar is at 17.

 

Long story short, they are both contemporary ODI number 8s. Not good enough with the bat to bat higher, not good enough with the ball to be considered specialists. There is a place in the team for them, but just one of them.

 

I know cricket is not won on datasheets but when the numbers reflect actual performance trends, then we need to start paying heed.

no. 8 these days should have >25 IMO.

[express bowling]

6 hours ago, jalebi_bhai said:

Just to put things into a bit more perspective, I've looked at Thakur and Chahar's List A stats and found something that reinforces the belief of many icfers that neither of these two can play as specialist bowlers:

 

In List A:

Chahar avg balls per innings: 42.6 (~7 overs)

Thakur avg balls per innings: 46.3 (~7 n half overs)

 

The two of them don't even average 8 overs per innings over their List-A careers so how can we play them as specialist bowlers in ODIs?

 

Their sub 30 bowling averages hold when they bowl their career mean deliveries in a game. The moment they go above the mean deliveries, they start getting smashed.

 

They also don't average 20 with the bat. Thakur just falls short at 19 and Chahar is at 17.

 

Long story short, they are both contemporary ODI number 8s. Not good enough with the bat to bat higher, not good enough with the ball to be considered specialists. There is a place in the team for them, but just one of them.

 

I know cricket is not won on datasheets but when the numbers reflect actual performance trends, then we need to start paying heed.

 

 

Superb post !

 

Very few people think about looking at whether a bowler can be bowled whenever needed. The test careers of Bhuvi Kumar and Praveen Kumar paint similar pictures. These are bowlers who can be used only in certain conditions and certain situations of the match. 

 

Playing too many of them just reduces the quality of our bowling. 

 

 

[deepdynamo]

They should have been in T20 team together. Give team balance, just 3-4 overs in their comfort zone and allow the top/middle order to blaze away realizing the batting is long enough with all the utility players.

 

But in ODI, they are strict No- No. ODI needs specialist with just 1-2 solid allrounders.

We should go with Pandya, Jadeja and Washington as three allrounders in the squad and relieve both of them from ODIs. the world cup is in India so don't think they have much chance anyways with Pandya already there.

My top 8 for the world cup and then pick three solid bowlers even if they all are No.11

Rohit
Dhawan / Gill
Kohli
Iyer  /Sky
Rahul /Pant 
Pandya
Jadeja
Washington

[singhvivek141]

12 hours ago, rkt.india said:

But batting bhi to koi aisi reliable nahi hai. Both crapped in the two games. Batted like proper tailenders.

Batting to openers ki bhi reliable nahi hai...sab ke sab under pressure crumble like paper under fire.