DAVID LLOYD: All Tests would be over in two days and ODIs in four hours if the India captain's views on umpire's call were taken on board

[sage]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricket/article-9395013/David-Lloyd-Careful-Virat-Kohli-words-consequences.html

 

Quote

Umpires are being increasingly undermined in international cricket and there are players who seem to think they, rather than the officials, are running the game. 

Take Virat Kohli. Before the first ODI the India captain said umpire's call should be removed from the decision review system and if the ball is shown to be hitting any part of the stumps it should be given out.

Kohli does not seem to have taken the consequences into account. If everything is out, including when the ball is just clipping the bails, then all Tests would be over in two days. An ODI would be over in four hours. 

 

Bowlers known for their accuracy like Jimmy Anderson, Josh Hazlewood and Jasprit Bumrah would be taking eight wickets every innings.

When I was an umpire there was many a time I said 'not out' thinking it might be hitting but that it might also be missing. An element of doubt must be taken into account. That should still be the case today, as we see in the DRS on marginal calls.

Do you think broadcasters would pay big bucks If every game was rushed to a rapid conclusion by everything being given out? It would cost cricket millions and players' pay would also take a big cut.

 

Kohli also suggested England were pressuring umpires to give the 'soft signal' as out when Dawid Malan took a low catch in the fourth T20. Firstly, the soft signal is there to leave as much authority as possible with the on-field umpires.

And I don't know if England put pressure on Nitin Menon in Ahmedabad, but I do know one thing — Kohli has been pressuring, disrespecting and remonstrating with umpires throughout this tour.

There have also been a number of altercations in India which, when copied, will permeate through every level. There was another on Tuesday near the end of the India innings. You should not confront an opposition player on the field. It's just not done. And the toothless International Cricket Council have done nothing.

 

It's the same with slow over-rates. When T20 cricket was introduced in 2003 it was short, sharp and great fun. Now it's like the Alamo. Games are lasting more than four hours! And Tuesday's first innings of 50 overs took over four hours! The consequences? Again, broadcasters, especially terrestrial ones, will be wary of buying the product because they don't know how it's going to affect their schedules.

Yes, the ICC fined both teams during the T20 series but the players will not give a damn. We don't know how much they are being fined, who is paying them and where the money goes.

Umpires have to be given their authority back. They must be handed yellow and red cards to stamp that lost authority because they look powerless. And Kohli, who has vast responsibility and influence, should be very careful in what he says and does.

 

 

[putrevus]

Lloyd is completely wrong there, you don't keep umpire's call so it match can be extend to four or five day.That is a wrong reason to keep umpire's call, we can debate about accuracy of Hawkeye and for that reason you need to have umpire's call.

[neel roy]

And he should take his tuktuk and bugger off

[G_B_]

Re the 4 hours thing. I would say images shown to the third umpire have been slow. One single review takes 5 minutes. Then you have to check for 4 or 6 or catches. T20 was designed to be around 3 hours 30 min.

 

 

 

 

[SK_IH]

Lloyd makes a good point about umpires' call. 

[sage]

15 minutes ago, putrevus said:

Lloyd is completely wrong there, you don't keep umpire's call so it match can be extend to four or five day.That is a wrong reason to keep umpire's call, we can debate about accuracy of Hawkeye and for that reason you need to have umpire's call.

you can make both a deatonological argument (hawk-eye error margin) and a consequentialist argument (game will be worse off, far shorter matches) against kohli's suggestion

[putrevus]

1 minute ago, sage said:

you can make both a deatonological argument (hawk-eye error margin) and a consequentialist argument (game will be worse off, far shorter matches) against kohli's suggestion

Kohli suggestion like many other players suggestion is they don't want two outcomes for the same prediction.That ambiguity needs to be cleared. They have already tweaked umpires call couple of times. If tweaking it further means removing ambiguity then why not do it.

[SK_IH]

Iirc in the 2008 test series against Lanka, DRS did not have ball tracking system

[rkt.india]

14 minutes ago, SK_IH said:

Lloyd makes a good point about umpires' call. 

Problem is consistency. If umpire gives marginal decision as out its out. Margins should also be taken away from umpire. Like if ball is not hitting. 50%, it should be not out in either case whether umpire gives it out or not.

[putrevus]

ICC like Lloyd would be fools not to take players input in this matter.Rather than shutting players down, they need to have dialogue with all captains/coaches and take their input.  Undermining umpire's authority nonsense has to be thrown out of the window. Getting right decision should be more important than hurting umpire's feelings.

 

 

[putrevus]

1 minute ago, rkt.india said:

Problem is consistency. If umpire gives marginal decision as out its out. Margins should also be taken away from umpire. Like if ball is not hitting. 50%, it should be not out in either case whether umpire gives it out or not.

Margins being given to umpires is the biggest problem.

[Vk1]

umpire's call.. considering the small error from current technology, ball might hit or miss the stumps.. if its not umpire's call, it will still flick the stumps after considering the error. Very fair in my view. 

Edited March 24, 2021 by Vk1

[Lone Wolf]

Don't know about Umpire's call but Bumble has been constantly whinging since the tour began.   Rondu saala

[ShoonyaSifar]

Well Anil Kumble heads the ICC Cricket Committee, which is strongly in favour of umpire's call option to give some authority to field umpires. No wonder Kohli has been sooking about it.

[Vilander]

Umpire call is necessary to show that there is reason for doubt, but soft signal should not be abused.  Lloyd is correct when he speaks about the umpire call on lbw but he is wrong when he covers all soft signal scenario with this, for instance a third man catch lol, and he should not attack Kohli just because he provided a point of view about the rules of the game. Administration should listen to players to make the rules more neutral it will only improve the game.

Edited March 24, 2021 by Vilander

[ShoonyaSifar]

34 minutes ago, putrevus said:

ICC like Lloyd would be fools not to take players input in this matter.Rather than shutting players down, they need to have dialogue with all captains/coaches and take their input.  Undermining umpire's authority nonsense has to be thrown out of the window. Getting right decision should be more important than hurting umpire's feelings.

 

 

One captain whining about umpiring doesn't make it a global problem. FFS, the guy can barely get DRS reviews right. After over 5 years as a captain, still doesn't have a proper process of consultation before asking for reviews. And then he sooks about umpiring to reflect the attention away from his incompetence.

 

If he so strongly believes in not having umpire's call option, will he recall his batsmen if the ball is shown hitting stumps/ kissing the bails even marginally. He obviously won't because all he wants is fake drama instead of a genuine concern about right decisions.

[putrevus]

10 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

One captain whining about umpiring doesn't make it a global problem. FFS, the guy can barely get DRS reviews right. After over 5 years as a captain, still doesn't have a proper process of consultation before asking for reviews. And then he sooks about umpiring to reflect the attention away from his incompetence.

 

If he so strongly believes in not having umpire's call option, will he recall his batsmen if the ball is shown hitting stumps/ kissing the bails even marginally. He obviously won't because all he wants is fake drama instead of a genuine concern about right decisions.

It is a  problem and it has always been problem There is a the reason rulings on why umpire's call have changed a lot , before reviews were lost and now reviews are not lost. So stop with your nonsensical hatred. Any captain should be allowed to express his opinion.

 

 

Edited March 24, 2021 by putrevus

[GeeGaw]

I believe if you challenge a call and it's ruled 'Umpire's call' then you should lose the review.  The only way you keep a review is if the original call was deemed to be in error.

 

That will reduce the number of reviews and speed up the game on its own.

[Tattieboy]

24 minutes ago, Vilander said:

Umpire call is necessary to show that there is reason for doubt, but soft signal should not be abused.  Lloyd is correct when he speaks about the umpire call on lbw but he is wrong when he covers all soft signal scenario with this, for instance a third man catch lol, and he should not attack Kohli just because he provided a point of view about the rules of the game. Administration should listen to players to make the rules more neutral it will only improve the game.

Who is this administration that should listen to players ?

[ShoonyaSifar]

19 minutes ago, putrevus said:

It is a  problem and it has always been problem There is a the reason rulings on why umpire's call have changed a lot , before reviews were lost and now reviews are not lost. So stop with your nonsensical hatred. Any captain should be allowed to express his opinion.

 

 

Calling out someone's hypocrisy and incompetence isn't hatred.