Will Umesh surprise?

[maniac]

5 minutes ago, Mosher said:

Umesh will bowl either on the legs or give width outside off stump but in between he will bowl these jaffas out of nowhere to pick wickets. Story of his career. 

Ishant and Shami are in the same mould give or take a level above it below. It usually boils down to the support system, if he has a good support he will be lethal even if he bowls some mandatory loose balls 

Edited September 2, 2021 by maniac

[goose]

10 minutes ago, maniac said:

Ishant and Shami are in the same mould give or take a level above it below. It usually boils down to the support system, if he has a good support he will be lethal even if he bowls some mandatory loose balls 

Ishant bowls jaffas to 1st slip

[BacktoCricaddict]

1 hour ago, rkt.india said:

He is a tukka bowler. He himself doesn't know or sure about what he is doing but his natural ability, skiddy pace with good seam makes Him deceptive. Batsmen can take him lightly seeing those half volleys on pads and suddenly a wicket taking ball. He has such a good outswing but he can't use it because he can't bowl it in right areas enough.

Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good.  Indebted to him for sending 66 back.   

[mishra]

I think he bowled beatifully. And got the wicket immediately after he was allowed to change the end

[R!TTER]

2 hours ago, rkt.india said:

He is a tukka bowler. He himself doesn't know or sure about what he is doing but his natural ability, skiddy pace with good seam makes Him deceptive. Batsmen can take him lightly seeing those half volleys on pads and suddenly a wicket taking ball. He has such a good outswing but he can't use it because he can't bowl it in right areas enough.

And what about that 100+ match ka gadha, still no leader of the pack? What is he according to you? Do you know how many tests Umesh has played in NZ+SA+Eng combined vs your favorite Ishu ma? I count these 3 having much more assistance than Oz for pacers, yet what is the record of this ghanta 

Still avg over 30 - he is by far the worst player to ever play 100 tests, it's not even a contest!

[Ankit_sharma03]

2 hours ago, maniac said:

Ishant and Shami are in the same mould give or take a level above it below. It usually boils down to the support system, if he has a good support he will be lethal even if he bowls some mandatory loose balls 

they are much higher

Umesh for all his talent hasnt adapted well in any format or any other apart from red ball in India . You cant even say he is limited in ability.

 

Shami is a lil inconsistent but he has turned games overseas which is why he is knwn as 2nd innings shami .  At times he is expensive but not like umesh 

Ishant has had huge struggle but still was consistent for last few yrs and is better then in every country then umesh apart from India 

 

dnt think he lacked any support system , he just didnt rise to next level in international . In international cricket u need to adapt to diff condition n format- its the adapting which is where he has failed 

[Vijy]

Umesh has generally flattered to deceive overseas, which is however compounded by the fact that he only gets 1-2 tests at most, and is therefore rusty. so far he has bowled okay.

[Vilander]

4 hours ago, Mosher said:

Umesh will bowl either on the legs or give width outside off stump but in between he will bowl these jaffas out of nowhere to pick wickets. Story of his career. 

Ok so Root got the customary umesh jaffa this time.. Cool luck for India. 

[goose]

i'm not saying Umesh is good or anything. but i can see some evidence of ability. he has the tools. i can actually visualize a wicket when he balls. ishant on the other hand looks like he wants an oscar just for getting the ball to the other end.

[express bowling]

Siraj is not looking fully fit from the 3rd test onwards.

 

Shami is not playing.

 

Bumrah is bowling superbly.

 

This means we need Umesh to step up and be the 2nd fast bowler for this test match.

 

So far he has done ok. Needs to put the ball in the right areas regularly.  

 

Only Bumrah and Umesh are hurrying batsmen in this test so far. So, he will be the key.

 

 

[rkt.india]

11 hours ago, R!TTER said:

And what about that 100+ match ka gadha, still no leader of the pack? What is he according to you? Do you know how many tests Umesh has played in NZ+SA+Eng combined vs your favorite Ishu ma? I count these 3 having much more assistance than Oz for pacers, yet what is the record of this ghanta 

Still avg over 30 - he is by far the worst player to ever play 100 tests, it's not even a contest!

I think Umesh is much more of a favourite for me than Ishant would ever be and that's why I bash him more because he could be so much better. With that kind of ability, he isn't India's best test bowler is an unfulfilled potential. Umesh has played 21 tests overseas with averaging 41 and ER of 4 and that ER is the biggest reason most captains couldn't trust him for overseas test. While Ishant is past it and team needs to move forward and bring new blood. For me, no one is bigger than the team as I don't believe in sheer fanboyism.

Edited September 3, 2021 by rkt.india

[Vk1]

Umesh has the most beautiful action and a is naturally atheletic gifted bowler.. should have had a much better career

[R!TTER]

36 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Umesh has played 21 tests overseas with averaging 41 and ER of 4 and that ER is the biggest reason most captains couldn't trust him for overseas test.

Most of those tests were in Oz - by far the hardest place to bowl for anyone, including pacers. He's played less than double digits in Eng/SA/NZ combined IIRC. Heck Ishant has played more in Eng than Umesh in all the three I mentioned combined & yeah Umesh has more ability but he also needed more backing! Do you think he got that under Kohli or especially Dhoni?

 

I'm pretty sure if you discount the 2018 year even Ishant has been sh!t in this area, Umesh bowls a more fuller length naturally & will be punished more - overall JB & to a much lesser extent Shami are definitely more reliable than either, but the difference is the yes man Shamaji ka ladla got way more chances than the other gadha mazdoori karne wala.

[R!TTER]

Needless to say these are all time chump level numbers, avg over 62 across 10 tests 

Opposition team Australia

Home or away away (home of opposition)

Start of match date between 1 Jan 2000 and 31 Dec 2017

Type of bowler (by style) pace bowler

Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20

Ordered by economy rate (ascending)

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Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econ	SR	5	10
I Sharma	2008-2014	10	17	351.3	50	1243	20	3/38	6/155	62.15	3.53	105.4	0	0
Z Khan	2003-2012	7	11	241.4	31	877	25	5/95	7/130	35.08	3.62	58.0	1	0
UT Yadav	2011-2015	7	12	236.3	29	1099	25	5/93	7/176	43.96	4.64	56.7	1	0

Edited September 3, 2021 by R!TTER

[rkt.india]

3 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Needless to say these are all time chump level numbers, avg over 62 across 10 tests 

Opposition team Australia http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif

Home or away away (home of opposition) http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif

Start of match date between 1 Jan 2000 and 31 Dec 2017 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif

Type of bowler (by style) pace bowler http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif

Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20 http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruRemove.gif

Ordered by economy rate (ascending)

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Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econhttp://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/blackArrowUp.gif	SR	5	10
I Sharma	2008-2014	10	17	351.3	50	1243	20	3/38	6/155	62.15	3.53	105.4	0	0	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Z Khan	2003-2012	7	11	241.4	31	877	25	5/95	7/130	35.08	3.62	58.0	1	0	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
UT Yadav	2011-2015	7	12	236.3	29	1099	25	5/93	7/176	43.96	4.64	56.7	1	0	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif

Ishant has been rubbish in Australia, no doubt about that. Umesh has done better than him but nothing to brag about.

Edited September 3, 2021 by rkt.india

[R!TTER]

Ishant has been rubbish everywhere except that small phase post 2018 where we had juicy pitches all over the world & of course DRS, you know why Umesh doesn't feature here - it's because he didn't even play 5 tests in SA/Eng/NZ combined! That's not down to his control, quite clearly Ishant wasn't setting the world on fire with his numbers 

View overall figures [change view]

Primary team India

Opposition team England or New Zealand or South Africa

Home or away away (home of opposition)

Start of match date between 1 Jan 2000 and 31 Dec 2017

Type of bowler (by style) pace bowler

Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 10

Ordered by economy rate (ascending)

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Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econ	SR	5	10
P Kumar	2011-2011	3	5	158.3	38	443	15	5/106	7/169	29.53	2.79	63.4	1	0
B Kumar	2014-2014	5	7	172.5	45	506	19	6/82	6/103	26.63	2.92	54.5	2	0
J Srinath	2001-2001	2	4	85.0	22	257	13	6/76	8/104	19.76	3.02	39.2	2	0
Z Khan	2001-2014	23	42	887.3	193	2868	94	5/29	9/134	30.51	3.23	56.6	5	0
I Sharma	2009-2014	17	28	671.3	118	2382	60	7/74	9/162	39.70	3.54	67.1	3	0
Mohammed Shami	2013-2014	7	13	270.5	43	980	21	4/70	6/219	46.66	3.61	77.3	0	0
S Sreesanth	2006-2011	12	21	438.0	76	1602	44	5/40	8/99	36.40	3.65	59.7	2	0
RP Singh	2007-2011	4	7	126.3	27	465	12	5/59	7/117	38.75	3.67	63.2	1	0
A Nehra	2001-2002	5	9	148.5	22	574	12	3/34	5/54	47.83	3.85	74.4	0	0
AB Agarkar	2001-2002	6	10	176.4	26	698	11	2/59	3/118	63.45	3.95	96.3	0	0

Edited September 3, 2021 by R!TTER

[R!TTER]

Kudos for him in taking advantage of favorable conditions post 2018 but let's not pretend he's been anything but rubbish for 70-90% of his pathetic career, & you need brains+skills to work as pacer in India otherwise every tom/dick/harry would be routing us at home!

Edited September 3, 2021 by R!TTER

[mishra]

34 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Kudos for him in taking advantage of favorable conditions post 2018 but let's not pretend he's been anything but rubbish for 70-90% of his pathetic career, & you need brains+skills to work as pacer in India otherwise every tom/dick/harry would be routing us at home!

I think, Umesh has been mostly asked to bowl in non favourable Indian conditions. His place was generally allocated to someone like Ishant or others each time we have played overseas(SENA). This series itself is a examle

Edited September 3, 2021 by mishra

[R!TTER]

 

7 minutes ago, mishra said:

I think, Umesh has been mostly asked to bowl in non favourable Indian conditions. His place was generally allocated to someone like Ishant or others each time we have played overseas(SENA). This series itself is a examle

Yes & wrongly so IMO - even when Ishant was not there Umesh wasn't a regular in favorable conditions - remember Lord's 2014? Well Ishant got injured right after that, Umesh didn't play a single test in Eng back then IIRC there's clear bias when it came to selecting Ishant & not picking Umesh for some reason!

[mishra]

1 hour ago, R!TTER said:

 

Yes & wrongly so IMO - even when Ishant was not there Umesh wasn't a regular in favorable conditions - remember Lord's 2014? Well Ishant got injured right after that, Umesh didn't play a single test in Eng back then IIRC there's clear bias when it came to selecting Ishant & not picking Umesh for some reason!

Call me conspiracy theorist or what ever, Long back, when we were filled with Thalas Trundler , I think he said something when criticised by  Thala, Thala may not have liked. "I am in the team because of my pace: Umesh Yadav