What do modern players have to do to match Viv Richards in ODIs?

[zen]

In the period covering the first 4 world cups (1975 to 1987) and by and large involving red ball cricket (and no power plays, etc.), only two significant batsmen had an average of over 45 had an SR of 85 or more: 

 

Viv Richards - Avg 53, SR 90

Zaheer Abbas - Avg 47, SR 85 (his avg and SR could be influenced by playing v India) 

 

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0
IVA Richards (WI)	1975-1987	139	126	20	5629	189*	53.10	6233	90.30	10	41	7
Zaheer Abbas (PAK)	1975-1985	60	58	5	2484	123	46.86	2921	85.03	7	12	2

 

 

In the period covering the next 3 world cups in the 90s (1988-1999), no key batsman achieved this feat. 

 

 

In the 2000-2011 period:

 

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
HM Amla (SA)	2008-2011	52	51	5	2538	140	55.17	2759	91.98	8	15	1	252	13
MS Dhoni (Asia/IND)	2004-2011	192	172	48	6446	183*	51.98	7257	88.82	7	43	6	498	133
MEK Hussey (AUS)	2004-2011	166	138	43	4862	109*	51.17	5540	87.76	3	35	3	344	68
SR Tendulkar (IND)	2000-2011	224	220	19	9540	200*	47.46	11105	85.90	24	51	8	1127	82
AB de Villiers (Afr/SA)	2005-2011	119	115	16	4523	146	45.68	4954	91.29	11	26	5	427	76
SR Watson (AUS)	2002-2011	126	112	20	4098	185*	44.54	4532	90.42	6	25	8	416	93

 

 

In the 2012-2022 period (the 3rd ODI World Cup is in 2023), it is relatively more common (evolution):

 

 

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
AB de Villiers (SA)	2012-2018	108	103	23	5054	176	63.17	4519	111.83	14	27	2	413	128
V Kohli (IND)	2012-2022	191	185	29	9611	183	61.60	10001	96.10	36	46	10	898	112
Babar Azam (PAK)	2015-2022	92	90	12	4664	158	59.79	5197	89.74	17	22	3	423	46
LRPL Taylor (NZ)	2012-2022	126	121	25	5422	181*	56.47	6435	84.25	16	31	3	454	64
KC Sangakkara (SL)	2012-2015	98	93	10	4503	169	54.25	5107	88.17	14	26	5	434	42
RG Sharma (IND)	2012-2022	162	159	17	7593	264	53.47	8257	91.95	27	34	9	735	230
JE Root (ENG)	2013-2022	158	147	23	6207	133*	50.05	7140	86.93	16	36	7	496	46
MS Dhoni (IND)	2012-2019	154	122	36	4276	139*	49.72	4964	86.14	3	30	4	325	96
F du Plessis (SA)	2012-2019	130	124	18	5219	185	49.23	5870	88.90	12	33	3	475	63
SPD Smith (AUS)	2012-2022	109	105	11	4574	164	48.65	5216	87.69	12	29	3	407	44
JM Bairstow (ENG)	2012-2022	89	81	7	3544	141*	47.89	3387	104.63	11	15	7	403	86
HM Amla (SA)	2012-2019	128	127	9	5575	159	47.24	6419	86.85	19	24	3	570	40
DA Warner (AUS)	2012-2022	131	129	6	5797	179	47.13	6037	96.02	19	25	2	619	89
TM Dilshan (SL)	2012-2016	111	108	11	4555	161*	46.95	5350	85.14	12	23	5	516	20
Q de Kock (SA)	2013-2022	135	135	7	5833	178	45.57	6074	96.03	17	29	4	670	88
Fakhar Zaman (PAK)	2017-2022	62	62	4	2628	210*	45.31	2807	93.62	7	14	5	301	48
S Dhawan (IND)	2013-2022	162	159	10	6724	143	45.12	7313	91.94	17	38	4	838	78

 

 

In terms of averages and SRs, what would be today's equivalent of Viv Richards #s of 53 and 90 respectively? ABDV's #s, where his average is close to 64 and an SR of over 108, appear to create a similar (not necessarily exact) impact! 

 

Edited March 30, 2023 by zen

[tapandrun]

One should read his stats in terms of how relevent he is in current times/era, Avg ~50 and SR 90+ that too at #4.

These numbers are still relevent after 30 years of his retirement, these numbers will also be good enough to consider him great of this era as well.

All the teams would love to have a batter like this in 11. He will make it in playing 11 of all the ODIs team right now

There was no match to him when he was playing and the batter next to him was ages behind. He was so ahead of every1.

 

So a modern day batter has to have an average + SR that would be relevent after 30  years of them retiring and there should be no one near them in their contemporary.

So hypothetically a batter has to have avg. near 70 and SR 135+.

 

These looks big numbers and if u see current player there are many having near 50 average and near 100 SR, so in that respect an avg. of 70 and SR of 135+ will make more sense.

 

 

 

Edited March 31, 2023 by tapandrun

[Moochad]

I think Sachin is comparable to him.

 

ABD is more talented than both, but his lack of success in World Events won't allow him to be compared to either. 

 

 

Edited March 31, 2023 by Moochad

[Majestic]

ABD with a Kohli level swagger = Viv Richards 

[Majestic]

18 minutes ago, Moochad said:

I think Sachin is comparable to him.

 

ABD is more talented than both, but his lack of success in World Events won't allow him to be compared to either. 

 

 

Sachin or Kohli don't possess the power or six hitting ability of a Viv Richards.

[AuxiliA]

ABD is the most talented white ball batsman I have known. However like mentioned above his legacy will take a hit due to not winning big trophies. 

[Suhaan]

Although a late bloomer,I found Symonds very close to Viv(not taking his average over the years)but he was quite consistent in that period 2003-6/7 maintaining healthy SR

[mishra]

It will be nice if someone can get top 2 or 3 bats of Vivs era from Australia, England,Pakistan,India and West Indies. I guess these were serious Teams and best being West Indies and Aussies as second best.

 

And similar stats can be prodeuced for every 10 Years. If there is a deviation in averages of Top bat and others that delta change in deviation need to be applied. On basis of that we can find out what should be average.

 

I feel there was Viv , then Rest in odi in his era,

There was Scahin and then Rest in odis in his era

But by the time Kohli,Smith and all came, the rest bats improved their average as well as SR vis a vis top bats and thats why, in modern world, cricket has mooved away from individual brilliance (It was only till Sachin era but signs were there, Australia and South Africa both were top Teams) to Team brilliance (Allmost all Teams England Australia India have top players not too far from second best in the Team)

 

Edited March 31, 2023 by mishra

[nevada]

4 hours ago, mishra said:

It will be nice if someone can get top 2 or 3 bats of Vivs era from Australia, England,Pakistan,India and West Indies. I guess these were serious Teams and best being West Indies and Aussies as second best.

 

And similar stats can be prodeuced for every 10 Years. If there is a deviation in averages of Top bat and others that delta change in deviation need to be applied. On basis of that we can find out what should be average.

 

I feel there was Viv , then Rest in odi in his era,

There was Scahin and then Rest in odis in his era

But by the time Kohli,Smith and all came, the rest bats improved their average as well as SR vis a vis top bats and thats why, in modern world, cricket has mooved away from individual brilliance (It was only till Sachin era but signs were there, Australia and South Africa both were top Teams) to Team brilliance (Allmost all Teams England Australia India have top players not too far from second best in the Team)

 

From Viv's time, there's two players with a 40+ average and total ODI career runs in the similar ballpark(6-7k) as him - Javed Miandad and Dean Jones. But both probably have a SR that is lower by 20+ points. Allan Lamb was a gun ODI bat for England in back to back world cups and had a 40+ average at one point but I think he retired with lesser than 40 ave and his total career ODI runs is just 4k+ IIRC. Viv was head and shoulders above his contemporaries. 

[zen]

My 1st concrete memory of Richards is from the 1988 tour where he scored a 110* at Rajkot to almost single-handedly win the game for WI. Ind scored 225 so a decent score considering India could get out to WI for less than 200  and picked up some wickets, however, Richards hit 7 6s - Link 

 

In the test series, he won WI the Delhi tests as well in the 4th inning - Link

 

 

[tapandrun]

16 hours ago, Majestic said:

Sachin or Kohli don't possess the power or six hitting ability of a Viv Richards.

 

Sachin was hitting 6s before back and elbow injury, after that he changed his batting entirely.

 

Had a good bat speed but , back injury made thin change his technique .

 

[Tibarn]

A question is how much should Viv's average be adjusted in order to account for the 60 over ODIs

[Lord]

On 3/31/2023 at 11:54 AM, AuxiliA said:

ABD is the most talented white ball batsman I have known. However like mentioned above his legacy will take a hit due to not winning big trophies. 

 

Trophy is a team achievement. Viv won trophy coz he played in champion side.

[Vijy]

richards had the power of symonds/klusener (very underrated ODI bats), the innovation of ABDV, the consistency of Brat, and the technical solidity of Tendu.

 

The GOAT ODI batter although not by as big a margin as some may claim.

[AKane]

Be like Viv? First try to bat their entire career with a cricket cap and not helmet?

 

<Cue - entry of people trying to prove how it is harder to play pace with helmet. That is why everyone uses a helmet as it is harder to play pace with it!!! Go figure>

 

Even with a helmet we now have "concussion substitute"!! The whole sport has been p#ssified.

Edited April 2, 2023 by AKane

[AKane]

23 hours ago, Vijy said:

richards had the power of symonds/klusener (very underrated ODI bats), the innovation of ABDV, the consistency of Brat, and the technical solidity of Tendu.

And played insolently without a helmet.

[putrevus]

Kohli is GOAT in odis, Richards was great but he was not better than Kohli.

[vvvslaxman]

On 4/1/2023 at 10:38 AM, Lord said:

 

Trophy is a team achievement. Viv won trophy coz he played in champion side.

 

He has individual achievement too

 

[Chakdephatte]

AB De Villiers is the limit.

Can't beat 53/101 in any era.

Only major batsman with better strike rate is Buttler and look at the average difference. Viv Richards wouldn't have done any better today. 

[Strangering]

If SKY could consistently stay at his peak for several years. In my mind, that would be the equivalent of what Viv was in his era. 

 

Altho, I think you have to account for ABDV as the next best thing after Viv tho. 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Strangering