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Opposition, libtards opposing Citizenship Amendment Bill

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Balakot

Mission Shakti

General election verdict

Triple Talaq abolition

Chidambaram jailed

370, bifurcation, UTs 

Hurriyat dogs, soft separatists, anti-national voices in Kashmir jailed

Chandrayaan II

Ayodhya verdict

CAB tabled

 

Maaan so much accomplished in one year...libtards ko kitna zaleel kiya :aha:doubt we will ever have another such bonanza year. 

Edited by Gollum

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On 12/7/2019 at 12:14 AM, coffee_rules said:

https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/northeastern-states-to-be-shielded-from-citizenship-law-impact/article30126585.ece

 

There is also talks of sheilding them. The protest is a non-starter, just a training ground to breed future politicians.  

 

The OP was about the liberal meltdown because Ms were excluded. Hence, I brought it up.  I am not a fan of TNT. But since it has happened, I blame the Muslim leadership of that era to bhadkao Muslims to vote for it. Since it has happened, it is very much necessary to recognize the fact that Ms are fleeing these areas and migrating to India and it has to be stopped. They are not being prosecuted but are fleeing for economic or political reasons. What was the reason for Rohingyas to settle in Jammu of all places. Demography changes is the next threat to National security. Yes, I am talking about the same issue raised by OP and reason for intellegentsia in India crying about the loss of original idea of India. Yes, the idea has changed now, to a newer India. 

Before my reply, I just want to state that it should be possible for us to have a discussion on a certain topic without taking into account the religious background of the people in the debate. 

 

Hence I choose to reply to you and not to @Vilander who lacks any kind of understanding of the issue, and thereby can only resort to low level name calling.

 

In none of my posts have I ever mentioned that Muslim illegal migrants from Bangladesh be granted citizenship. I don't know why that is brought up repeatedly?

 

Various reports suggest that many student bodies in the North East and particularly Assam are against the Bill. I would imagine that these are the regions that would stand to gain most by such an amendment. They are against the bill for the simple reason, that they fear getting swamped even if it is by their co-coreligionists and fear loss of control/identity. Why would these people, whom the bill is ostentatiously supposed to benefit, be against it?

PS: Tribal parts of Assam and the North East are excluded from this Bill. Not the North East in its entirety.

 

Another point, is how do you verify religious persecution. How does one establish if a person is 'forced and/or compelled to seek shelter in India due to religious persecution on the ground of religion'? What if a an economic migrant claims to be persecuted etc etc. I do not know how the GoI is going to go about establishing credentials here.  

Edited by Mariyam

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2 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Before my reply, I just want to state that it should be possible for us to have a discussion on a certain topic without taking into account the religious background of the people in the debate. 

 

Hence I choose to reply to you and not to @Vilander who lacks any kind of understanding of the issue, and thereby can only resort to low level name calling.

 

In none of my posts have I ever mentioned that Muslim illegal migrants from Bangladesh be granted citizenship. I don't know why that is brought up repeatedly?

By ignoring the rationale for CAB coming from partition and not including muslims, I assumed you were for Muslims to be included. 

Quote

Various reports suggest that many student bodies in the North East and particularly Assam are against the Bill. I would imagine that these are the regions that would stand to gain most by such an amendment. They are against the bill for the simple reason, that they fear getting swamped even if it is by their co-coreligionists and fear loss of control/identity. Why would these people, whom the bill is ostentatiously supposed to benefit, be against it?

PS: Tribal parts of Assam and the North East are excluded from this Bill. Not the North East in its entirety.

Yes, but in Tripura and Assam, the parties who formed the govt won on the support to NRC and CAB. These protests are mainly coming from AIUDF which is a BD Immigrant front in Assam (Badruddin Ajmal ) . If there are protests, they are coming from fringe groups trying to gain mileage politically and not a grassroots campaign. That is the impression from MSM as well.

https://www.firstpost.com/politics/amid-anti-cab-protests-in-assam-bjps-himanta-biswa-sarma-rehashes-2016-playbook-against-aiudfs-badruddin-ajmal-7760921.html

 

Quote

Another point, is how do you verify religious persecution. How does one establish if a person is 'forced and/or compelled to seek shelter in India due to religious persecution on the ground of religion'? What if a an economic migrant claims to be persecuted etc etc. I do not know how the GoI is going to go about establishing credentials here.  

We are talking about Islamic republics of Pakistan, Afghanistan and BD. Check the non-Muslim population decrease in these areas. Go to world HRC sites and check the number of stories of conversion, kidnapping of girls, forced marriages. Even if they falsely claim persucution, non-muslims have no future in these countries. Can't believe we are asking for proof of persecution. Looks like liberals asking Hindus to be persecued much more before they listen to their stories.

https://swarajyamag.com/politics/citizenship-bill-opponents-are-really-asking-for-hindus-to-be-persecuted-twice-over

Quote

The ‘secular’ parties who want the CAB to be junked are essentially asking that Hindus should be persecuted twice or thrice over by insisting that illegal Muslim migrants must also get the same rights to citizenship as persecuted Hindus.

 

Edited by coffee_rules

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3 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Another point, is how do you verify religious persecution. How does one establish if a person is 'forced and/or compelled to seek shelter in India due to religious persecution on the ground of religion'? What if a an economic migrant claims to be persecuted etc etc. I do not know how the GoI is going to go about establishing credentials here.  

Religious persecution is what happens in Afg, Pak, BD. India may have many faults but our minorities don't have to go to neighboring countries begging for shelter.

 

Afg...minorities wiped out

Pak...many fleeing to Ind

BD...‘No Hindus will be left after 30 years’ drop from 22% to less than 8% now

 

Minorities in these countries need help first, others can wait cos gravity of the situation says so. We have limited resources, need to give preference to some...you'll notice even Lankan Tamils (esp Hindus and Christians of Northern Province who have been persecuted by Sinhalese Buddhists) haven't been included in this amendment bill. Cos SL has a significant Tamil pop and will continue to do so....clock ticking fast for these 3 countries in question. 

 

Indian Muslims won't be touched. Moreover we are talking about illegal immigration here, if Balochis or Ahmadis want to migrate to India they have a legal option, our govt can handle on case by case basis. 

 

Anyway this is too late, many illegals from BD have already settled in India with all kinds of certificates...there is an entire industry to help them in Bengal and Assam, in Bengal I have seen this happen openly under Left Front regime. 

Edited by Gollum

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3 minutes ago, maniac said:

BJP Just need to win a WC

 

83- Indiramma

2007/2011- Soniamma

 

Time for BJP to intervene and make Rohit the LOI captain :hitler:

Add 1985 BH and 2013 CT :((

 

But our test team has given us some great moments...2001 Aus series, 2003-04 Aus, 2004 Pak, 2015 onwards #1, 1st series win downunder, GOAT home stats

 

Sucked in all the Olympics under BJP reign, hope we make amends in Tokyo. 

 

Our badminton has thrived under the BJP govt :dance:, Jai Teluguland. 

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9 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Before my reply, I just want to state that it should be possible for us to have a discussion on a certain topic without taking into account the religious background of the people in the debate. 

 

Hence I choose to reply to you and not to @Vilander who lacks any kind of understanding of the issue, and thereby can only resort to low level name calling.

 

In none of my posts have I ever mentioned that Muslim illegal migrants from Bangladesh be granted citizenship. I don't know why that is brought up repeatedly?

 

Various reports suggest that many student bodies in the North East and particularly Assam are against the Bill. I would imagine that these are the regions that would stand to gain most by such an amendment. They are against the bill for the simple reason, that they fear getting swamped even if it is by their co-coreligionists and fear loss of control/identity. Why would these people, whom the bill is ostentatiously supposed to benefit, be against it?

PS: Tribal parts of Assam and the North East are excluded from this Bill. Not the North East in its entirety.

 

Another point, is how do you verify religious persecution. How does one establish if a person is 'forced and/or compelled to seek shelter in India due to religious persecution on the ground of religion'? What if a an economic migrant claims to be persecuted etc etc. I do not know how the GoI is going to go about establishing credentials here.  

I will believe that he/she is persecuted if a Hindu/Buddhist/Sikh from Pak/Bangladesh wants to come to India and become citizen. It does matter if they are not really persecuted in real. Non-muslims in these countries can be given citizenship in India because these countries are created as Islamic nations and their ancestors could not come to India for whatever reason and now they want to come. That is sufficient reason for me to accept them in India as citizens.

In short, IMO GoI need not waste time and efforts in determining whether persecution of those people is genuine. 
All GoI need to do is that they are indeed non-muslims from Pak/BD/Afg as they claim themselves to be and want to be part of India. 

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This issue is again all about Muslim veto power. Muslims vote for certain parties cuz they guarantee a veto say. Its never about development, progress. 
 

And BJP is the largest party which disagrees with that kind of secularism, and thus we have Indian politics. 

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Congress wanted Communal Violence Bill where every Hindu would be seen as a criminal. Whereas, this CAB recognises Hindus can be victims. 
 

Its a welcome change, and all this debate is hogwash. Its only about two things. This Hindu can be victims? And Muslim veto? 

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On 12/5/2019 at 6:39 PM, javier26 said:

There is Ram in Ramzaan and Ali in Diwali 

This one takes  the gold.  I remember in 90s there was an ad played on Doordarshan which they will keep repeating 10 times a day movie named "Data" starring Mithun and famous song " ye teri meri yari". In that Ad film bolded dialogue was widely used.

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On 12/9/2019 at 4:04 AM, Gollum said:

Balakot

Mission Shakti

General election verdict

Triple Talaq abolition

Chidambaram jailed

370, bifurcation, UTs 

Hurriyat dogs, soft separatists, anti-national voices in Kashmir jailed

Chandrayaan II

Ayodhya verdict

CAB tabled

 

Maaan so much accomplished in one year...libtards ko kitna zaleel kiya :aha:doubt we will ever have another such bonanza year. 

Meh! All these are anti-Muslim!

 

 

 

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[mention=24037]Tibarn[/mention] [mention=25956]Moochad[/mention] [mention=25771]Stradlater[/mention] Even if CAB is passed in RS what scope do milords have to overturn this? Will they cling on to basic structure, preamble etc to overturn the act? Fundamental rights is only for Indian citizens I think, will they be able to circumvent that? I don't know our constitution that well, what will the basis of the counter-argument? 
 
This is a huge moment in modern Indian history, trust libtards to throw spanner in the works. 
Basic structure, Preamble does not apply to foreigners.

Sent from my Nokia 7 plus using Tapatalk

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I am a little disappointed to see the views on this thread, particularly from posters I tend to agree with more often than not. I am not in favour of CAB and I am about as far from a libtard as one can possibly be.  Let's look at the main problems:

 

1) SECURITY THREAT

 

https://thewire.in/security/cab-could-be-misused-by-foreign-agents-to-infiltrate-india-raw-had-said

 

RAW had already raised concerns. What is to say that Pak (we'll ignore Afg and Bangladesh for now) won't send Hindus/Sikhs/Christians to spy on us? What if they send someone to cause trouble in Punjab? And they undoubtedly will. Their devious designs are already in place if you've watched the speeches of their ministers and leaders in the lead up to and post the opening of Kartarpur corridor. I have personally seen how Sindhis from Pakistan (Hindus) who live in India proudly claim that their hearts still beat for Pakistan. And you'd rather trust them than Indian Muslims? Shame on you guys!

 

2) Our relationship with N.E is weakened

 

In the aftermath of August 5 (which I fully endorse and agree was the need of the hour), Pakistan knows it can't hope to get Kashmir back. They will definitely try to start trouble in the N.E - see their leaders mouthing off about Nagaland, Manipur, etc. This Amendment Bill is being strongly opposed by N.E (Bhaichung Bhutia himself commented on it) and there are strong/violent protests in N.E if reports are to be believed. Given that they are so vital to our security interests and territorial integrity, is it worth antagonizing our own and taking in PAKISTANIS, AFGHANS AND BDs just so we can take in potential spies and terrorists from Pakistan?

 

Instead of focusing on things like the economy, rising onion prices and terrible cases of rape, we are talking about utterly useless nonsense like CAB. We are not Norway or Sweden and we don't have enough resources to feed our own. So effectively, what we are doing is:

 

1. Taking in potential security threats

2. Antagonizing vast sections of our own population (N.E, Muslims, etc.)

3. Depleting our already scarce resources - we are still a poor country all said and done

4. Tarnishing our image on the world stage

 

and some of you have the gall to label this as a great move! Absolutely sickening. I genuinely thought the current party would be an improvement over the Italian madam, but as more and more time passes, it is becoming apparent that they are just two sides of the same coin. Hopefully, the Supreme Court will strike this rubbish down and sense will prevail. India is for Indians: we don't need illegal immigrants from any religion. Period. 

 

And lol at having a go at Maryam - is this what it has come down to? We will push them into a corner and then cry foul when they respond.

 

Ye Abdul Hamid ki sarzameen hai, ye Asfaqullah Khan ki sarzameen hai, yaad rakho. Jai Hind :)

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Wow! Can't imagine UPA government giving back such a response to a US Body. This is an evangelical body who keeps meddling in all countries where they can't freely convert. But our libs salivate whenever this US Body gives out anti-Hindu comments, but this time they are cheering the US Body to impose sanctions on India and Indian HM! Such patriots.

 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/uscirf-statement-on-cab-neither-accurate-nor-warranted-mea/articleshow/72454704.cms

 

 

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The shiv sena is just lol worthy

 

The cmp they signed with ncp cong says joint desicions at national level. Then they support bill at ls where they know bjp will pass anyways. They will vote against in rs where numbers tight.

 

Do they think in era of sm nobody will find out?

 

Sena i feel are stuck in the 90s in the way they go their politics

 

 

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NE states are up in arms..esp Assam. I have few relatives in Guwahati..they are scared, the student organisation like Aasu and Nsui are raking up anti bengali sentiments... and mind u, most Assamese are anti bengali (both hibdus and muslim) they'd rather support a assamese muslim then a bengali hindu..few shops and business estb have been burned down and massive protests are taking place.

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37 minutes ago, G_B_ said:

The shiv sena is just lol worthy

 

The cmp they signed with ncp cong says joint desicions at national level. Then they support bill at ls where they know bjp will pass anyways. They will vote against in rs where numbers tight.

 

Do they think in era of sm nobody will find out?

 

Sena i feel are stuck in the 90s in the way they go their politics

 

 

AIADMK is the most solid ally of BJP, they always put the country first. They have stood by BJP in many major decisions this year, supported CAB in LS, have pledged support in RS despite no mention of Sri Lankan Tamils. Doubt the Akalis would have been on board if Sikh interests were comrpomised, BJP should be grateful to Amma's party which is taking great political risks by extending unflinching support. Hope the flag of AIADMK always flies high in the state, instead of having too much ambition BJP should realize that the future of the state should be in the hands of AIADMK which combines Dravidian priniciples of social justice and pro-Tamil language/culture, is unabashedly religious when it comes to dharmic matters, and wears patriotsim on its sleeve. DMK can go to hell. 

Edited by Gollum

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44 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

Wow! Can't imagine UPA government giving back such a response to a US Body. This is an evangelical body who keeps meddling in all countries where they can't freely convert. But our libs salivate whenever this US Body gives out anti-Hindu comments, but this time they are cheering the US Body to impose sanctions on India and Indian HM! Such patriots.

 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/uscirf-statement-on-cab-neither-accurate-nor-warranted-mea/articleshow/72454704.cms

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, sergio04 said:

And irony is posters here share the wire articles.

You have always had a chip on your shoulder about me. The wire article I shared was about how RAW had concerns about the security issues that allowing Pakistanis, Afgs, BDs into our country would pose.

 

You reacted troll to a perfectly reasonable post. You are the defenition of an idiot who lives in his own echo chamber. Get out of your basement and actually do something for your country instead of trolling with useless rubbish 24*7.

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30 minutes ago, Gollum said:

To ease the burden on NE, the immigrants should be distributed all over India, just like how the illegal Bangla Muslims have made their homes in Delhi, Mumbai, Kerala...

Illegal people who have made their homes here should be sent back. The answer to that is not accepting more illegal immigrants, many of whom are likely to be security threats.

Edited by Dil Dil India

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2 minutes ago, Dil Dil India said:

You have always had a chip on your shoulder about me. The wire article I shared was about how RAW had concerns about the security issues that allowing Pakistanis, Afgs, BDs into our country would pose.

 

You reacted troll to a perfectly reasonable post. You are the defenition of an idiot who lives in his own echo chamber. Get out of your basement and actually do something for your country instead of trolling with useless rubbish 24*7.

Hey idiot, stop commenting if you don't know me personally. 

 

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1 minute ago, sergio04 said:

Hey idiot, stop commenting if you don't know me personally. 

 

If your online persona is anything to go by, I pity anyone who knows you personally (assuming that there are actually people who know you). Bone-headed troll, no reasoned arguments, no nothing just troll reacts and one-liners that would make KRK cringe.

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Just now, Gollum said:

To ease the burden on NE, the immigrants should be distributed all over India, just like how the illegal Bangla Muslims have made their homes in Delhi, Mumbai, Kerala...

They have exempted some NE states , tribal areas of Assam. These protests is mainly from NSUI, AIUDF (Momin party) who are bringing up regional sentiments over religion. Congress played around the issue for too long for BJP to come and fix the issue in 5 years. 

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@Dil Dil India, ignored your long post cos I thought you were having a bad day. Since you quoted me I'll try and refute your points. Will start of by saying that today you are on the same page as Rana Ayyub, Imran Khan, Arfa Khanum, Owaisi, Kavita Krishnan, Mehbooba Mufti, Badruddin Ajmal, Tukde Tukde Gang etc and a person is known by the company he/she keeps. We all make mistakes, to err is human...knowing your posting history I don't think you belong to that company of illustrious names, so hope to change your views. 

Quote

 

1) SECURITY THREAT

 

https://thewire.in/security/cab-could-be-misused-by-foreign-agents-to-infiltrate-india-raw-had-said

 

RAW had already raised concerns. What is to say that Pak (we'll ignore Afg and Bangladesh for now) won't send Hindus/Sikhs/Christians to spy on us? What if they send someone to cause trouble in Punjab? And they undoubtedly will. Their devious designs are already in place if you've watched the speeches of their ministers and leaders in the lead up to and post the opening of Kartarpur corridor. I have personally seen how Sindhis from Pakistan (Hindus) who live in India proudly claim that their hearts still beat for Pakistan. And you'd rather trust them than Indian Muslims? Shame on you guys!

They will send scumbags irrespective of what we do, their basic nature. Doesn't matter if RS passes CAB or not as far as they are concerned.

 

Cut-off date for citizenship is 31 Dec, 2014. If some Pakeee Hindu wants citizenship now he will need to go through the legal route. Read the salient features of the bill. 

 

Where did the comparison between them (Pak Hindus) and Indian Muslims come from? CAB has nothing to do with the status of Indian Muslims, don't let propaganda outlets like 'The Wire' mislead you. 

Quote

 

2) Our relationship with N.E is weakened

 

In the aftermath of August 5 (which I fully endorse and agree was the need of the hour), Pakistan knows it can't hope to get Kashmir back. They will definitely try to start trouble in the N.E - see their leaders mouthing off about Nagaland, Manipur, etc. This Amendment Bill is being strongly opposed by N.E (Bhaichung Bhutia himself commented on it) and there are strong/violent protests in N.E if reports are to be believed. Given that they are so vital to our security interests and territorial integrity, is it worth antagonizing our own and taking in PAKISTANIS, AFGHANS AND BDs just so we can take in potential spies and terrorists from Pakistan?

We can't run our country based on what Pakistan thinks/does, if that is the case we might as well open our borders, destroy our Parliament building, disband the armed forces and let Islamabad/Rawalpindi rule. It is a coward's way out, toeing the enemy line. If they create problem in NE, hit them back in Sindh and Balochistan, make costs of their misadventures unbearable. 

 

If the grouse is excessive load on NE, that can be discussed but which party is doing that? What stops them? I am all for those immigrants being distributed all across India. But lemme tell you as someone from Bengal, my state and NE are largely responsible for the illegal migrant influx. Our politicians allowed them to enter unchecked for votebank purposes, our corrupt police and public eased their entry and gave them certificates, cover, jobs, residence, everything. From there they went to Delhi, Jammu, Bengaluru, Hyderabad, Kannur....primary fault lies with us. Anyway some concerns addressed LINK , though I do hope remaining NE grievances are addressed in the form of amendments (or otherwise) in the future. 

Quote

Any exceptions to the Bill?
CAB won't apply to areas under the sixth schedule of the Constitution – which deals with autonomous tribal-dominated regions in Assam, Meghalaya, Tripura and Mizoram. The bill will also not apply to states that have the inner-line permit regime (Arunachal Pradesh, Nagaland and Mizoram).

I don't get the 'spies and terrorists' part. Do you seriously believe our agencies are that inept? Why not show some confidence in their abilities to sniff out the troublemakers? 

Quote

Instead of focusing on things like the economy, rising onion prices and terrible cases of rape, we are talking about utterly useless nonsense like CAB. We are not Norway or Sweden and we don't have enough resources to feed our own. So effectively, what we are doing is:

We can focus on economy, gender violence and ideology, all at the same time. India is a confused nation, as long as it remains that way no economic miracle will help us realize our potential.

 

Why is CAB useless? Those illegals were staying here one week back, they will stay here next month...where is the question of resources? Some will get citizenship, others will be off to detention camps, highly doubt BD/Pak/Afg will allow them back if we are being realistic. Huge section of Muslims agitated for partition, caused mayhem, went to Pakistan....if some of them (descendants) want to come back, sorry doors closed, their own doing. Hindus, Sikhs and Christians never agitated for any independent country, some were left behind because of geographical/economic reasons. 

 

Do you know Sikhs and Hindus who migrated in 1950-51 are yet to receive citizenship. Don't you find it unfair? Correction of this wrong is 'useless nonsense'? No empathy for those who took a bit more time to make that arduous journey? 

Quote

4. Tarnishing our image on the world stage

Does China bother about its global image? Russia? USA? Only the weak seek validation from others. We must do whatever is best for us, doesn't matter how many people it rubs the wrong way. 

Quote

and some of you have the gall to label this as a great move! Absolutely sickening. I genuinely thought the current party would be an improvement over the Italian madam, but as more and more time passes, it is becoming apparent that they are just two sides of the same coin. Hopefully, the Supreme Court will strike this rubbish down and sense will prevail.

Good for you.... same coin as in UPA's spinelessness post weekly terror attacks, bend-over before Pakistan, begging USA to stop the mean bully Pakistan, 26/11 RSS ki saazish, Batla encounter fake etc. Vote for them next time, apart from all this maybe we will see a new WR of 1st trillion dollar corruption scam. 370 can be brought back, Indian army can be told to go back to the days of showing the other cheek, 10000 other reasons that made UPA era so great !!!

Quote

And lol at having a go at Maryam - is this what it has come down to? We will push them into a corner and then cry foul when they respond.

You got to be more specific, at least I like Yam. 

Quote

Ye Abdul Hamid ki sarzameen hai, ye Asfaqullah Khan ki sarzameen hai, yaad rakho. Jai Hind :)

Careful, you don't want to go down that route because then questions will be asked about pre-1947 events and how forefathers of today's Indian Muslims voted. Anyway CAB isn't about Indian Muslims, so I will leave it at that. 

Edited by Gollum

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