Ind may not know how to use impact players

[zen]

In any key LOI series, one is likely to find the players among this group play in the top order (#1-3) - Rohit, Dhawan, Kohli, and KL. In most of the games, these guys will tuk tuk to pad their stats first before playing as per the situation. When they try to play as per the situation, they usually get out (while usually failing in KO games too). Because these guys stats pad, they also know that their positions are safe as selectors will probably look at rudimentary stats.

 

We hardly see a situation where a Pant or a SDP is sent up the order to try to blast the bowling attack. We hardly see any attempt to develop players by batting them in #1-3. 

 

 

[wanted_desi]

Everyone other than Pant is accumulator. 

[dilliboy]

Pant or V iyer should open and Rahul should play in the middle order..

[Trichromatic]

For once I agree with you. Approach of this team is pathetic. They bank too much on individual brilliance - one person doing consolidation and acceleration. 

 

Recently openers scored 70 runs in first 10 overs last year and it was first instance since 2011 WC. 

 

It's shocking how current set of batsmen are going in defensive mode compared to opening duo of Sachin-Sehwag who played from 2000s. 

 

Current team is still playing Dhoni brand of cricket, dig deep and wait for opposition to fold under pressure. Basically never take the pressure of accelerating unless bowlers start bowling badly under pressure.

 

Instead of that team should try to dominate and match RRR throughout the inning. So if the team falls behind at any stage, just promote hitters.

 

Having said that, Pant wasn't great in List A anyway.

[dilliboy]

4 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

For once I agree with you. Approach of this team is pathetic. They bank too much on individual brilliance - one person doing consolidation and acceleration. 

 

Recently openers scored 70 runs in first 10 overs last year and it was first instance since 2011 WC. 

 

It's shocking how current set of batsmen are going in defensive mode compared to opening duo of Sachin-Sehwag who played from 2000s. 

 

Current team is still playing Dhoni brand of cricket, dig deep and wait for opposition to fold under pressure. Basically never take the pressure of accelerating unless bowlers start bowling badly under pressure.

 

Instead of that team should try to dominate and match RRR throughout the inning. So if the team falls behind at any stage, just promote hitters.

 

Having said that, Pant wasn't great in List A anyway.

Reason young players won't do well is because India still values average much above strike rates in LoIs..hence you see Rahul going on accumulator mode from the start and Pant playing less risky shots. The template is all wrong and has been since 2015

[vvvslaxman]

7 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

For once I agree with you. Approach of this team is pathetic. They bank too much on individual brilliance - one person doing consolidation and acceleration. 

 

Recently openers scored 70 runs in first 10 overs last year and it was first instance since 2011 WC. 

 

It's shocking how current set of batsmen are going in defensive mode compared to opening duo of Sachin-Sehwag who played from 2000s. 

 

Current team is still playing Dhoni brand of cricket, dig deep and wait for opposition to fold under pressure. Basically never take the pressure of accelerating unless bowlers start bowling badly under pressure.

 

Instead of that team should try to dominate and match RRR throughout the inning. So if the team falls behind at any stage, just promote hitters.

 

Having said that, Pant wasn't great in List A anyway.

 

Overall agree. But Pant at this point can literally fail batting in any spot. Opening, at no.3 at no.4.  In order to look non chalant he keeps his feet absolutely still and just moves the hands.  Plays ultra low percentage shots as release shots. Also he doesn't rotate strike.  He is missing lot of ticks to be a reliable LOI batsman.  Every time we think he is turning a corner he flatters to deceive us.  Today he wasn't really in any pressure. Asking rate was fairly manageable as we lost by 30 odd runs in the end something he could have easily made up later. Not like we were chasing 350.

[maniac]

Can’t disagree here. Is there a rule why Dhawan shouldn’t be playing lower down the order?

[zen]

For a batsman, it is about getting to a 50, then a 100, than actually taking on the other team on  ... Even viewers lose heart at the fall of wkts and follow every game as if Ind has to win it with players price changing after every inning as if cricket is a day trading activity ... Most things in India are geared towards how not to play a sport 

[dilliboy]

5 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

Overall agree. But Pant at this point can literally fail batting in any spot. Opening, at no.3 at no.4.  In order to look non chalant he keeps his feet absolutely still and just moves the hands.  Plays ultra low percentage shots as release shots. Also he doesn't rotate strike.  He is missing lot of ticks to be a reliable LOI batsman.  Every time we think he is turning a corner he flatters to deceive us.  Today he wasn't really in any pressure. Asking rate was fairly manageable as we lost by 30 odd runs in the end something he could have easily made up later. Not like we were chasing 350.

Won't blame him too much for today's dismissal..slightly unlucky. His last 2 ODI innings against England where he made 77(40) and 78 (62) at No 4 showed me he should be backed at that spot..let's see how the rest of the games go

[vvvslaxman]

Just now, dilliboy said:

Won't blame him too much for today's dismissal..slightly unlucky. His last 2 ODI innings against England where he made 77(40) and 78 (62) at No 4 showed me he should be backed at that spot..let's see how the rest of the games go

 

Those were all 350 plus wickets. Pretty much anyone can score. Even Sam curran almost got a 100.

 

[coffee_rules]

SDP is now Simply Dropped Player

[Adamant]

I agree with your premise that top 3 are accumulators but  - 

who says that a player can develop only when he is playing in the top order? 

 

Pant, Iyer and Venky had their chance today and they simply failed. 

 

Chasing 145 in 132 balls wasn't an out of scope situation,  they would have won it for us if they played sensibly. 

 

Yuvraj Singh was never a top order player but didn't he went on to become one of the best impact players ever? 

 

Suresh Raina p played only 15 innings at number 3 and had a bad record at that position, went on to become one of our best middle order bat. 

 

 

 

Demanding top order spots for Iyer,Venky Pandya and Pant is simply nonsensical, they need to learn how to perform in their respective positions. 

 

Prithvi Shaw is a topr order bat, Ruturaj is a top order bat, Gill is suuted to number 3, same goes with Yashasvi now if all our upcoming talents are top order and you want Pant and Pandya also to get promoted then who the hell will bat in middle order.

 

This is yet another thread justifying the failure of middle order and blaming it on top order who actually gave them a solid base and a good opportunity to win. 

 

 

 

[Adamant]

1 hour ago, zen said:

For a batsman, it is about getting to a 50, then a 100, than actually taking on the other team on  ...  

Completely agree with this... 

In India it's always been about who scores more centuries who is the highest run maker etc

[vvvslaxman]

3 minutes ago, Adamant said:

I agree with your premise that top 3 are accumulators but  - 

who says that a player can develop only when he is playing in the top order? 

 

Pant, Iyer and Venky had their chance today and they simply failed. 

 

Chasing 145 in 132 balls wasn't an out of scope situation,  they would have won it for us if they played sensibly. 

 

Yuvraj Singh was never a top order player but didn't he went on to become one of the best impact players ever? 

 

Suresh Raina p played only 15 innings at number 3 and had a bad record at that position, went on to become one of our best middle order bat. 

 

 

 

Demanding top order spots for Iyer,Venky Pandya and Pant is simply nonsensical, they need to learn how to perform in their respective positions. 

 

Prithvi Shaw is a topr order bat, Ruturaj is a top order bat, Gill is suuted to number 3, same goes with Yashasvi now if all our upcoming talents are top order and you want Pant and Pandya also to get promoted then who the hell will bat in middle order.

 

This is yet another thread justifying the failure of middle order and blaming it on top order who actually gave them a solid base and a good opportunity to win. 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes. precisely. We are oversimplifying only reason they fail is because they didn't bat up the order. Not sure  that is the case here. India has won matches even during 2000s where run scoring was more difficult in the later half from even more precarious situations.

[coffee_rules]

CDP (the count) is now Could be Dropped Player 

 

When dropped, he becomes Certainly Dropped Player!!

 

Sorry @zen couldn’t help that. Promise last one!

Edited January 19, 2022 by coffee_rules

[zen]

6 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

CDP (the count) is now Could be Dropped Player 

 

When dropped, he becomes Certainly Dropped Player!!

 

Sorry @zen couldn’t help that. Promise last one!

Enjoy!! 

Edited January 19, 2022 by zen

[zen]

Try the below for the remaining games (will not happen):

 

V Iyer

Pant

SKY

Kohli

KL

S Iyer

Thakur

4 bowlers 

 

 

[Lord]

1 hour ago, coffee_rules said:

SDP is now Simply Dropped Player

 

[vvvslaxman]

He is like those tik tok girls who love to keep starting at their own body 24/7 lol

[coffee_rules]

1 hour ago, zen said:

Try the below for the remaining games (will not happen):

 

V Iyer

Pant

SKY

Kohli

KL

S Iyer

Thakur

4 bowlers 

 

 

Shreyas seems to be a safety first batseman and two left handers at top. Get Pant after SKY and open with Gaikwad or Rahul