What's the fuss about Sachin's 194 at Multan?

[Laaloo]

OP saala aag lagage bhaag gaya

[beetle]

I wish somebody had the guts to do something on March 16th 2012 ,Bangladesh .The Match that defines personal milestones.

 

[maniac]

7 minutes ago, Cricketics said:

Dravid and John were at fault but so was Tendulkar for not realizing the situation being the most senior player then and having played the game for 15 years by then.  It is not that he wasn't alerted before about declaration. He got some hint when message was sent during drinks before the last final declaration was done in hurry whenYuvi got out. 

He was clearly given a target...so of yuvraj was out and new batsmen was in..what is wrong with one more over and giving him an ultimatum to get to 200...heck you don't even need an ultimatum, Sachin has enough common sense to achieve that target...it was 2 overs prior to what he was told, so even if yuvi was out max delay would be 1 over for the new batsman and also Sachin was on strike.

 

Also if Sachin was selfish he wouldn't have run 2 and kept strike to get to his 200.

[beetle]

2 minutes ago, laaloo said:

OP saala aag lagage bhaag gaya

His attempt to increase traffic...

[maniac]

1 minute ago, radhika said:

I wish somebody had the guts to do something on March 16th 2012 ,Bangladesh .The Match that defines personal milestones.

 

Don't agree with that innings but that was for the greater good...getting that camel of his back was supposed to get the runs flowing again against more important teams in more important situations...didn't happen and Sachin walked out in to the sunset like the all conquering hero he is

[Vilander]

Just now, radhika said:

His attempt to increase traffic...

safe to say this thread will hit some good traffic..big chunks will have an opinion.

[Vilander]

OP my suggestion for your avatar.

 

 

 

[maniac]

Rahul Dravid's strike rate in matches we lost "chasing" in the 90's....from 1996-31 dec 2000

 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?batting_fielding_first=2;class=2;filter=advanced;orderby=batting_strike_rate;result=2;spanmax1=31+dec+2000;spanmin1=1+jan+1996;spanval1=span;team=6;template=results;type=batting

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
LR Shukla	1999-1999	1	1	0	13	13	13.00	10	130.00	0	0	0	1	0
PS Vaidya	1996-1996	2	2	0	15	12	7.50	12	125.00	0	0	0	2	0
A Kuruvilla	1997-1997	5	4	1	9	7	3.00	8	112.50	0	0	1	0	1
NA David	1997-1997	1	1	1	8	8*	-	8	100.00	0	0	0	0	0
P Dharmani	1996-1996	1	1	0	8	8	8.00	8	100.00	0	0	0	0	0
SS Karim	1997-2000	7	7	0	154	55	22.00	166	92.77	0	1	0	13	2
SR Tendulkar	1996-2000	36	36	0	1264	143	35.11	1385	91.26	1	10	2	128	17
J Srinath	1996-2000	29	27	3	296	43	12.33	327	90.51	0	0	4	17	9
RL Sanghvi	1998-1998	1	1	0	8	8	8.00	9	88.88	0	0	0	0	1
SB Joshi	1996-2000	18	17	3	203	61*	14.50	277	73.28	0	1	1	16	5
SC Ganguly	1996-2000	40	40	0	951	100	23.77	1334	71.28	1	4	0	115	2
RK Chauhan	1997-1997	4	4	1	17	12	5.66	24	70.83	0	0	0	0	0
T Kumaran	1999-2000	3	3	0	19	8	6.33	27	70.37	0	0	0	2	0
M Azharuddin	1996-2000	32	32	2	701	111*	23.36	1003	69.89	1	4	1	42	4
HK Badani	2000-2000	2	2	0	51	42	25.50	73	69.86	0	0	0	3	0
AR Kapoor	1996-1996	3	3	0	37	19	12.33	53	69.81	0	0	1	1	1
A Jadeja	1996-2000	37	37	1	1042	119	28.94	1501	69.42	2	4	4	72	16
S Sriram	2000-2000	2	2	0	18	12	9.00	26	69.23	0	0	0	2	0
SV Manjrekar	1996-1996	5	5	0	240	62	48.00	350	68.57	0	3	0	14	2
NR Mongia	1996-2000	28	28	6	486	69	22.09	714	68.06	0	1	1	36	5
R Dravid	1996-2000	39	39	0	1088	107	27.89	1607	67.70	1	6	2	90	2

Edited December 14, 2016 by maniac

[randomGuy]

1 hour ago, maniac said:

Name one cricketer who doesn't care about getting a 100 or heck even a 50 or a 5 wicket haul or a hattrick?

 

sehwag going for a 6 on 294 is not because he didn't care about the milestone, it has more to do with his arrogance and disdain for the bowler which makes him stand out but not that he cares any less about it.

 

yes when you don't have that ability those excuses make you stand out as unselfish.

 

even the so called unselfish teams like aus,England,nzl and even pure boyz pak delay declaration etc when a player is in the 90s

In all cases, you would give benefit of doubt to the captain. Maybe want to clarify in private. But you wouldn't feel particularly upset and/or go crying to the media.

[Vilander]

5 minutes ago, maniac said:

Rahul Dravid's strike rate in matches we lost "chasing" in the 90's....from 1996-31 dec 2000

 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?batting_fielding_first=2;class=2;filter=advanced;orderby=batting_strike_rate;result=2;spanmax1=31+dec+2000;spanmin1=1+jan+1996;spanval1=span;team=6;template=results;type=batting

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
LR Shukla	1999-1999	1	1	0	13	13	13.00	10	130.00	0	0	0	1	0
PS Vaidya	1996-1996	2	2	0	15	12	7.50	12	125.00	0	0	0	2	0
A Kuruvilla	1997-1997	5	4	1	9	7	3.00	8	112.50	0	0	1	0	1
NA David	1997-1997	1	1	1	8	8*	-	8	100.00	0	0	0	0	0
P Dharmani	1996-1996	1	1	0	8	8	8.00	8	100.00	0	0	0	0	0
SS Karim	1997-2000	7	7	0	154	55	22.00	166	92.77	0	1	0	13	2
SR Tendulkar	1996-2000	36	36	0	1264	143	35.11	1385	91.26	1	10	2	128	17
J Srinath	1996-2000	29	27	3	296	43	12.33	327	90.51	0	0	4	17	9
RL Sanghvi	1998-1998	1	1	0	8	8	8.00	9	88.88	0	0	0	0	1
SB Joshi	1996-2000	18	17	3	203	61*	14.50	277	73.28	0	1	1	16	5
SC Ganguly	1996-2000	40	40	0	951	100	23.77	1334	71.28	1	4	0	115	2
RK Chauhan	1997-1997	4	4	1	17	12	5.66	24	70.83	0	0	0	0	0
T Kumaran	1999-2000	3	3	0	19	8	6.33	27	70.37	0	0	0	2	0
M Azharuddin	1996-2000	32	32	2	701	111*	23.36	1003	69.89	1	4	1	42	4
HK Badani	2000-2000	2	2	0	51	42	25.50	73	69.86	0	0	0	3	0
AR Kapoor	1996-1996	3	3	0	37	19	12.33	53	69.81	0	0	1	1	1
A Jadeja	1996-2000	37	37	1	1042	119	28.94	1501	69.42	2	4	4	72	16
S Sriram	2000-2000	2	2	0	18	12	9.00	26	69.23	0	0	0	2	0
SV Manjrekar	1996-1996	5	5	0	240	62	48.00	350	68.57	0	3	0	14	2
NR Mongia	1996-2000	28	28	6	486	69	22.09	714	68.06	0	1	1	36	5
R Dravid	1996-2000	39	39	0	1088	107	27.89	1607	67.70	1	6	2	90	2

yeah so Dravid sucked in ODI esp when we lost,how is this relevant to the discussion. Its not that he has made a great number of centuries by playing slow there.

[Masquerade]

I think if Dravid had really told him that he would only declare with 15 overs left, then he's at fault for declaring 2 overs earlier. It's important to have a winning mentality but you shouldn't break promises.

 

What is really shocking though is how quickly Ganguly and the coach seemed to go behind Dravid's back to save themselves. Like Tendulkar, I find it very hard to believe they weren't privy to any decision. Classic case of them just trying to save themselves from the backlash that would occur. That's real selfishness in this case.

[kosingh]

It wasn't as bad as when Sachin wanted 100 100s or Kapil wanted 431+. 

[moniker]

This topic has probably resurfaced after Kohli's latest comments about getting personal milestones out of the system.

I'm more Sachin fan than Dravid fan, but I'm with Dravid on this one. It's perfectly human for Sachin to have been disappointed, but Dravid doesn't owe him any explanation or requires his convincing. He was the captain, he had the authority to declare and he declared. And following that up with saying that it's not in him to throw a tantrum, the self righteous attitude on display is a bit disconcerting.

I'm actually ok with slightly slowing down during the nineties. If you are nearing a personal milestone it does play on the back of your mind and on your nerves. That's human nature and is perfectly natural. But questioning team decisions for not favoring your personal milestones is difficult to accept. Yes, you do get disappointed, but you have got to pull yourself together and move on. You aren't entitled to any apology from anyone.

[kruiser]

Excellent thread...  Now need one on "Was Kapil involved in match fixing"

[Muloghonto]

1 hour ago, moniker said:

This topic has probably resurfaced after Kohli's latest comments about getting personal milestones out of the system.

I'm more Sachin fan than Dravid fan, but I'm with Dravid on this one. It's perfectly human for Sachin to have been disappointed, but Dravid doesn't owe him any explanation or requires his convincing. He was the captain, he had the authority to declare and he declared. And following that up with saying that it's not in him to throw a tantrum, the self righteous attitude on display is a bit disconcerting.

I'm actually ok with slightly slowing down during the nineties. If you are nearing a personal milestone it does play on the back of your mind and on your nerves. That's human nature and is perfectly natural. But questioning team decisions for not favoring your personal milestones is difficult to accept. Yes, you do get disappointed, but you have got to pull yourself together and move on. You aren't entitled to any apology from anyone.

I will disagree slightly: I see Tendulkar's disappointment as a communication failure, predominantly from Dravid's side. True, he can do what he wants and if it feels 'right', he has to make the call as a captain. But at the same time, if a player is closing in on a rare milestone & time is running out, if the captain makes a plan with the said player and then deviates, he does owe an apology- something along the lines of 'sorry mate, i know you wanted that milestone, but it just felt right to do what i did'.

I don't just think its the case because it involved Tendulkar.

Could you imagine, if time was running out on that Pakistan test and Kumble was stuck at 9 wickets, the captain says ' you get to bowl till end of play so you get perfect 10', which Kumble too desperately wanted (as has been pointed out by your, its natural to want rare milestones), then the captain decides to change Kumble's end and the bowler changing the ends for him picks up the final wicket ? Ofcourse Kumble would've been a bit disappointed and Azhar would've owed him an apology. 

 

I agree that sometimes you gotta throw a team-mate's personal ambition under the bus for the good of the team. But that doesnt mean the teammate wouldn't be disappointed and the captain shouldn't acknowledge that disappointment.

 

[Lannister]

I think even Dravid was tired of seeing how comfortably Sachin was scoring centuries. We had such a strong team back then, but we lacked unity. There was a slight glimpse of hope when Kumble took over though. 

[Gambit]

While there may have been some miscommunication, Dravid as captain, had all the right to declare whenever he felt it was the right time to put Pakistan in. Tendulkar, judging from his celebrations after bowling Moin Khan, seemed to get over his disappointment quickly the next day.

[Deleted_User_1]

Since when did H play for anything but for his records???

[Texan]

Why is this 194 not out crap more important than our first ever victory over Pakistan in Pakistan?

[Texan]

10 hours ago, radhika said:

I wish somebody had the guts to do something on March 16th 2012 ,Bangladesh .The Match that defines personal milestones.

 

The culture seems to be changing now with Kohli in charge. Him saying that personal accomplishments are not important might just be his single biggest contribution to Indian cricket if he can truly enforce it.