Its high time we distinguish between IPL and International players

[Austin 3:!6]

This is one of the drawbacks of IPL...we have too many mediocre players who is playing for India after 1 or 2 good season in IPL.

 

Likes of Umran Malik, Harshal Patel, Venkatesh Iyer etc are simply not international class. 

 

I think we should not get carried away by IPL form and pick every tom dick harry for international matches.

 

Indian cricket is slowly under decline but we are not realizing it

[vvvslaxman]

Venkatesh Iyer actually did well for India. It is the IPL where he sucked this season. His strike rate is 164 in T20 avge 33.

[I6MTW]

Umran Malik did decently. I don't think he bowled as fast as he did in IPL though. 

[zen]

We should be happy to have a wide pool for players to choose from, allowing India to play multiple series at the same time or keeping key bowlers fresh for key series. 

 

[Abhilash93]

Harshal Patel is only suited to the slower pitches back home where his slower balls grip. His 130kph pies are cannon fodder elsewhere.

[vvvslaxman]

2 minutes ago, Abhilash93 said:

Harshal Patel is only suited to the slower pitches back home where his slower balls grip. His 130kph pies are cannon fodder elsewhere.

 

I think that factor has to be given some weightage. Shami can be more lethal than Harshal on surfaces like this.

[putrevus]

More and more IPL teams are becoming dependent on their four international players to carry them. That itself should say a lot about talent level of Indian players in IPL.If they make it five then it will be completly dominated by foreign players.

Edited June 28, 2022 by putrevus

[Norman]

Lol you're getting this now? 

 

I realized this way back in 2010 when Murali Vijay was selected for the WT20 team on the back of his IPL form. Of course he then proceeded to play some fine test knocks as an opener. 

[zen]

1 hour ago, I6MTW said:

Umran Malik did decently. I don't think he bowled as fast as he did in IPL though. 

 

Yes, in fact, many of the guys have done well in the recent series have done well in IPL too ... Bowlers like Moshin have not even been considered ... Arshdeep, who can bowl accurately, wasn't even played ... Many of those not doing well (or relatively poorly) have been carried over from internationals against NZ, WI, SL, etc. 

 

 

[Serpico]

Mediocre Ipl players are not forcing anyone to select them. Selectors, coaches are supposed to look for more than stat sheets and figure out who is real talent. If Dravid saw Harshal in the nets and thought he's good enough to play international, its his failure in judgement 

[putrevus]

1 minute ago, Serpico said:

Mediocre Ipl players are not forcing anyone to select them. Selectors, coaches are supposed to look for more than stat sheets and figure out who is real talent. If Dravid saw Harshal in the nets and thought he's good enough to play international, its his failure in judgement 

You are 100 percent correct.You never can blame players for wanting to play..But we also have to understand selectors and coaches can only pick players from pool , they cannot create talent.

 

To succeed in international cricket against good teams you need players with actual talent .

[Serpico]

1 minute ago, putrevus said:

You are 100 percent correct.You never can blame players for wanting to play..But we also have to understand selectors and coaches can only pick players from pool , they cannot create talent.

 

To succeed in international cricket against good teams you need players with actual talent .

Yep completely agree, but that's different problem. Even if ipl was not there, we'll still be left with same mediocre talent pool 

[putrevus]

7 minutes ago, Serpico said:

Yep completely agree, but that's different problem. Even if ipl was not there, we'll still be left with same mediocre talent pool 

Agreed on talent pool but in my view what IPL has done, it has given these bozos a false sense of accomplishment and entitlement.Viv Richards strutting to crease would make bowlers quiver but Pandya doing the same makes it comical.Unfortunately IPL has made these comedians into superstars to some people.

[maniac]

One way to fix it is to make it 4 mandatory Indian players instead of 4 overseas slots going forward only because I in IPL stands for India. Otherwise quality looks a little bare at the moment. Only in T20 though. Our  domestics are strong enough to still produce world class test and odi players.

Edited June 28, 2022 by maniac

[sandeep]

3 hours ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

This is one of the drawbacks of IPL...we have too many mediocre players who is playing for India after 1 or 2 good season in IPL.

 

Likes of Umran Malik, Harshal Patel, Venkatesh Iyer etc are simply not international class. 

 

I think we should not get carried away by IPL form and pick every tom dick harry for international matches.

 

Indian cricket is slowly under decline but we are not realizing it

I disagree.

 

The problem is not player 'quality'.  Its the selection logic, criteria, and roles assigned.

 

They refuse to incentivize the right batting tactics - they gave Ruturaj Gaikwad 6 games in a row ahead of guys like Shaw and Samson -why? Because his aggregate runs got him that stupid color IPL cap whatever it is.  

 

This has been a problem for Indian whiteball cricket ever since the ODI rules were changed, and even ODI cricket now rewards teams that bat deep, and bat selflessly at the top.  Indian XI isn't built for that kind of cricket.  They keep stacking the team with 'anchors' and expect them to 'adapt'.  That's now how T20 works, you are good at what you repeatedly execute and practice.  

 

 

[sage]

We need to tweak the orange cap to include a strike rate element. We can give different awards for fastest knock minimum 15 balls etc why don't we innovate the IPL 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Vilander]

3 hours ago, Norman said:

Lol you're getting this now? 

 

I realized this way back in 2010 when Murali Vijay was selected for the WT20 team on the back of his IPL form. Of course he then proceeded to play some fine test knocks as an opener. 

 

Selectors 

 

[zen]

I think the issue is also with many Indian fans, who expect a new player to perform like an experienced one "just" because he has played IPL. IPL is usually held in Asia (India & UAE) where Indian players are familiar with conditions. When these new players play international cricket in India, they do well there too. 

 

Difficult for a new player to instantly step in & play like someone who has played tons of games in multiple conditions. Players take time to adjust in unfamiliar conditions. 

 

If we look at the series against SA, new Indian players, who are familiar with home conditions, competed well against a strong SA. In Ireland, many of the players were playing their first series OS, and they adjusted well there too esp. the batsmen on good batting surfaces.

 

Of the 3 players mentioned in the OP, Umran & Harshal, actually played their first series outside India! Umran, in his 2nd outing, won India the game, while Harshal played his first game outside India today. 

 

Also look at Hooda, who was also playing his first series outside India. He hit a 100 today and remarked - "To be honest, I was coming from a good IPL and wanted to follow the same performance. Happy with my intent. I like playing in that manner (aggressive) and these days I am batting up the order so getting some time. Sanju is my childhood friend, always good to bat with him. Thank you to fans, the way they came and supported us."

 

 

PS also in IPL, players (and teams) do not perform consistently. Most players do well in 1/4th to 1/3rd of the games that they play in the competition, and even the best teams lose to weak teams on the day when the weak team fires its cylinders. It is credit to tournaments like IPL that Ind's new players are able to adapt relatively quickly to new conditions with confidence. 

 

 

Today, we saw a great thriller where the match was won on the last ball. The first game was won by India in style through some relatively experienced hands. New players (Hooda-Umran), many of them on their first overseas tour, shone to bring India a 2-0 series win. These guys are expected to get better with experience. What more could you ask for on a Tuesday? 

Edited June 28, 2022 by zen

[Suhaan]

So Umran is mediocre,based on what?

Your assessment?

He bowled 4 overs for 42 ,did you see dimensions of the ground,experience of the bowler,did you?

Harshal is mediocre ,no doubt about that

Yaar , cricket bauhat change ho gaya hai

 

Batsmen won't back out that easily in t20s ,they will come after bowlers ,it's a batsmen's game afterall

You can't just roll them over, rookies like Umran will learn with each game

Wish he had someone like Steyn to work with,got Mhambrey instead

 

Edited June 29, 2022 by Suhaan

[Suhaan]

1 hour ago, zen said:

I think the issue is also with many Indian fans, who expect a new player to perform like an experienced one "just" because he has played IPL. IPL is usually held in Asia (India & UAE) where Indian players are familiar with conditions. When these new players play international cricket in India, they do well there too. 

 

Difficult for a new player to instantly step in & play like someone who has played tons of games in multiple conditions. Players take time to adjust in unfamiliar conditions. 

 

If we look at the series against SA, new Indian players, who are familiar with home conditions, competed well against a strong SA. In Ireland, many of the players were playing their first series OS, and they adjusted well there too esp. the batsmen on good batting surfaces.

 

Of the 3 players mentioned in the OP, Umran & Harshal, actually played their first series outside India! Umran, in his 2nd outing, won India the game, while Harshal played his first game outside India today. 

 

Also look at Hooda, who was also playing his first series outside India. He hit a 100 today and remarked - "To be honest, I was coming from a good IPL and wanted to follow the same performance. Happy with my intent. I like playing in that manner (aggressive) and these days I am batting up the order so getting some time. Sanju is my childhood friend, always good to bat with him. Thank you to fans, the way they came and supported us."

 

 

PS also in IPL, players (and teams) do not perform consistently. Most players do well in 1/4th to 1/3rd of the games that they play in the competition, and even the best teams lose to weak teams on the day when the weak team fires its cylinders. It is credit to tournaments like IPL that Ind's new players are able to adapt relatively quickly to new conditions with confidence. 

 

 

Today, we saw a great thriller where the match was won on the last ball. The first game was won by India in style through some relatively experienced hands. New players (Hooda-Umran), many of them on their first overseas tour, shone to bring India a 2-0 series win. These guys are expected to get better with experience. What more could you ask for on a Tuesday? 

Indian fans despite hating( faking) Rohit,Kohli,KL drool over the prospect of watching them play